stance experiment

[ubizmo]

I went to the driving range today to continue my "standard versus square" experiment, but after about 40 balls it seemed pretty clear that I was hitting better with the square swing.

So I decided to try something else.

I had been hitting with my left foot flared out toward the target a bit, to make it easier to get my hip around, but it occurred to me that it's the *right* foot that would make a difference with that. So I tried flaring my right foot toward the target too. Basically, I set up my shot with my feet parallel. I set my grip, club distance, etc. Then I just swivel a bit, shifting both heels to the right just a little, so my feet end up like this: \\, but I keep my hips facing forward (despite the tendency now for them to open to the target).

I proceeded to hit the longest, straightest balls of my practice session. Very nice satisfying contact with the ball. I tried it with several clubs and got consistent results. The feeling was that this shift (which was less pronounced than the backslashes above) "pre-loaded" my hips to turn into the swing.

Like all driving range "discoveries," this one may disappear tomorrow, but I thought I'd throw it into the mix. Weird, isn't it?

[ubizmo]

Re: stance experiment

Back in the late 60's early 70's a former tour player wrote a book on keeping the feet turn in that direction and in Hawaii the book sold like wildfire.

Interesting! It just goes to show that there's nothing so weird that someone hasn't already tried it.

His major short coming was he never sloved the problem of how to slove the restricted shoulder turn.

Well, the purpose of the shoulder turn, as I see it, is to coil the spine to store energy that get used when it uncoils, like winding a spring. If that's so, it shouldn't matter that the shoulder doesn't go quite as far back. You can still coil and uncoil.

It work great for people with flexibilty who swung their hands too far back and up to start with.

Never thought about that but I can see it could be a problem. A person with too much flexibility would have to turn so far to reach the coil point that it would hard to get back to the target line.

But that sure isn't my problem.

Same principel as Lee Trevino is using, toes are not as pointed in, but he is able to push off the back foot.

Also interesting. It remains to be seen whether this is something that will really work for me. Sometimes I get the feeling that doing just about anything differently can help for a little while. I've lost count of the times I tried something new at the driving range and thought I was onto something great, only to find that next time I couldn't reproduce it.

[Poppio]

Re: stance experiment

<<<Also interesting. It remains to be seen whether this is something that will really work for me. Sometimes I get the feeling that doing just about anything differently can help for a little while. I've lost count of the times I tried something new at the driving range and thought I was onto something great, only to find that next time I couldn't reproduce it.>>>>

You have just discovered "The Six Week Rule of Golf." No matter what you change or what piece of equipment you buy it will work for a maximum of six weeks. Then your body or your mind or both together will overcome the change and things will be at least as bad as they were, but probably worse.

Joe

[ubizmo]

Re: stance experiment

In my case it's more like six hours.

[Ian Hancock]

Re: stance experiment

Hi Todd,

What you have discovered is minimal hip rotation, by turning both feet or even one foot toward the target you restrict hip turn.

Most top players have minimal hip rotation, by minimizing this you create toque in the body hence the distance, also it will allow your arms to get through past your hips.

However it is not advisable to stick with this discovery, not with the feet pointing sideways I mean, by all means turn your left out a little.........................but what you are trying to achieve is the sensation you discovered with square feet, simply hold the rotation of the hips as much as possible. It should work just the same only with better accuracy.


It is a good way to teach someone the feeling required for a good turn.


Ian.

[ubizmo]

Re: stance experiment

What you have discovered is minimal hip rotation, by turning both feet or even one foot toward the target you restrict hip turn.

However it is not advisable to stick with this discovery, not with the feet pointing sideways I mean, by all means turn your left out a little...

If minimal hip rotation is desirable, then a wider stance should be helpful, right?

Maybe I don't understand the hip rotation effect as well as I should. Seems to me that not that much rotation away from the target on the backswing is wanted, because we want as large as possible a difference between shoulder and hip rotation, the so-called x-factor. But we want plenty of hip rotation at the end of the downswing, to help keep the hands ahead of the club head.

Flaring the lead foot out holds the left hip back in the backswing; turning the right foot in urges the right hip forward in the downswing. Or so it seems to me. Hence the \\ stance. The effect is a bit like opening the stance a little, but feels more "coiled."

Then again, it could be the placebo effect!

[Ian Hancock]

Re: stance experiment

Todd,
You seem to understand this action very well, you are correct minimal hip rotation on the backswing creates torque, on the downswing the hip release forward fully to create torque just before impact (ie opposite to the backswing), combined with a late realese of the club this makes a tour player.

However turning both your feet to an 'open' position will create other problems in shot making etc. You can create the hip rotaion simply by thinking about it as you swing for a while until it becomes engrained (about six weeks for me). Keeping the left foot flat during the swing has the exact same affect, try it.


Ian.

[ashante15]

Re: stance experiment

Todd:

Back in the late 60's early 70's a former tour player wrote a book on keeping the feet turn in that direction and in Hawaii the book sold like wildfire.

His major short coming was he never sloved the problem of how to slove the restricted shoulder turn. It work great for people with flexibilty who swung their hands too far back and up to start with.

Very easy to bring the club back and have good release with power behind it.

I do a little demo and turn my back to the target and hit a straight ball and then I will go to the other extreme and hit like you stated.

If you find yourself pulling the ball you can open the clubface at address or take a weaker grip.

If you are slicing the hands are coming too far to the outside in the backswing.

Same principel as Lee Trevino is using, toes are not as pointed in, but he is able to push off the back foot.

G-1.

CMays,

Do you by chance know the name of the book and the person who wrote it? Someone on this forum posted a link previously but I cannot seem to locate it. Thanks.