Proper position of spined shaft?

[westcoast941]

Hey all,

I was reading some old posts. Back when LowPost got his first heads and was asking questions of finding the spine of the shaft.

Gord, you had mentioned of positioning the spine of the shaft toward the target.

I had bought a JB spine finder, nice item I might add. In it's instruction it states for better distance postion the neutral part of the shaft toward the target. For better shot shaping use the spine itself toward the target.

Make sense? I'm not doubting just your guy's take on this

BTW I was looking for more distance

[tpg1965]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

If you get into the hairiest of mathematics you'll find any shaft has two natural frequencies and they are always located 90 degrees apart on the shaft. At one point you will get one of these frequencies and by rotating the shaft 90 degrees you'll get the other. If the shaft is flexed anywhere in between both frequencies will be excited and the two will beat against one another causing the shaft to wobble. The two frequencies in a steel shaft or a filament wound graphite shaft are generally very close such that very little wobble will occur. In wrapped graphite shafts this is not always the case due to the seam and wobbling can be pretty wild.

[LowPost42]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

In it's instructions it states for better distance postion the neutral part of the shaft toward the target. For better accuracy use the spine itself toward the target.

This is the spine theory I adhere to. FWIW, JB (Jerry Ballard) is an absolute clubmaking genius. I bought his hydraulic shaft puller (pro model). If I ever have to replace it, I'd buy another one in a heartbeat.

To add, once I mark the spine (I use the deflection method with an NF4), I then FLO the shaft. Then I align FLO plane to target, with the spine oriented for control in my clubs, and for distance for most clients (this is their usual request).

[westcoast941]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

I spined a set of Rifle 4.5flex .355 taper to use in my Ping eye2s

you'll find any shaft has two natural frequencies and they are always located 90 degrees apart on the shaft.

I did find this in the RP rifles. The instructions read to find the strongest NBP and mark it N1, find the other NBP that is not as strongly flexed and mark this one N2. Then do the same finding the spine.

This is the spine theory I adhere to...I then FLO the shaft. Then I align FLO plane to target, with the spine oriented for control in my clubs, and for distance for most clients...

I have not figured how to FLO yet. These were my first attempt at spine finding so I just went with finding the spine. Not sure if this is going to have a negative effect?

I did find my instructions and it states he as well as 80% of golfers prefer the NBP or neutral @ 9oclock or toward target at address and excellent ball strikers would prefer the spine @ 9oclock

I still have some confusion but my ADD is kicking in so I'll email Jerry Ballard about them, cause if I continue this post will ramble

Thanks all

[LowPost42]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

FLOing requires a laser light and a good clamp.

[lgskywalker37]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

is there some kind of spining certification? do reputable companies ever screw up spining, is it posible to do it wrong? and how could i tell if my spining was done correctly?

[LowPost42]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

is there some kind of spining certification?

Ther closest thing I've seen is a process called SST PURE.

do reputable companies ever screw up spining, is it posible to do it wrong? and how could i tell if my spining was done correctly?

According to Dave Tutleman, bearing type finders can be confused by finding the residual bend, and not the true spine. There is no point in buying shafts that have been spined but not tipped, as I've seen the spine move after tipping. Now, this could be the residual bend that's shifting, and not the actual spine, but I haven't checked this in my NF4.

[westcoast941]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

According to Dave Tutleman, bearing type finders can be confused by finding the residual bend, and not the true spine...

Oh great

Well maybe us that have used the bearing way have gained some benefit of the shaft flex if not all of it? Just hoping it doesn't mess things up.

Ben, you've written some pretty insightful stuff in your journal. Your entry of giving up distance for control, I've been wondering myself, I've investigated shafts and what they're good for. Although I am unable to express my thoughts as well as you have.

Hope your thumb is better? that does hurt

[lgskywalker37]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

so is their a way to find out if it has been done correctly? will i know if someone screwed up by just swinging it, or does someone have to test it?

[lgskywalker37]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

There is no point in buying shafts that have been spined but not tipped, as I've seen the spine move after tipping. Now, this could be the residual bend that's shifting, and not the actual spine, but I haven't checked this in my NF4.

Tipped? now what is that, i am jsut learning about spining and now there is something else called tipping? there anything else i shoudl know about getting custom made clubs?

[LowPost42]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

Tipping is the term that is applied to cutting the end of the shaft that goes into the hosel (also known as the tip end - as opposed to the butt end; which is the part of the shaft where the grip goes).

As for can you tell by swinging - I'm not sure. It will largely depend on your swing. I myself know that my swing isn't consistent enough to be able to tell if a set of clubs is spined or not. However, by spining the clubs, I take that variable out of the equation. You'd have to have the clubs tested.

[westcoast941]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

Tipped? now what is that, i am jsut learning about spining and now there is something else called tipping? there anything else i shoudl know about getting custom made clubs?

Tip cutting for say, .370 parralell shafts uncut shafts. R flex can be R were cutting the tip might be something like 1iron no cut, 2iron 1/2" cut and 1/2" each shorter iron. To make them Stiff you might cut an additional 1 1/2" each iron. Just a generalazation. Depends on the shaft. Ladies flex can be cut to senior flex. Some shafts can be cut to include all 4 flexes. .355 tapered shafts are not tipped cut. Wood shafts have their own specifications. There's enough info on the web to find what cut needs to be done..

So you don't want to spine find before you have tip cut to flex and butt cut to length. The spine will change after cutting.

If you're thinking about doing your own, read up it Golfsmith's website has decent info on building
http://www.golfsmith.com/cm/display_...um=cm_trimming
or maybe buy some new pull shafts from Ebay. They would be already cut to flex and many have new grips too..

If you have the clubs made don't worry too much about it. They guy knows how to cut them as for spining them, it's becoming more mainstream for clubmakers to do this...ask

OEM manufactured clubs, Callaway, Nike etc., none of the shafts are spined, hell up untill recently the shafts weren't even matched for consistancy of flex. And they still sell for close to a grand

[lgskywalker37]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

Tipping is the term that is applied to cutting the end of the shaft that goes into the hosel (also known as the tip end - as opposed to the butt end; which is the part of the shaft where the grip goes).

ok thanks for the explanaiton. so is tipping something that is done to every club. you said how you shouldn't spine anything unless you tip it also. sounds to me like tipping is something that done while joining the club and the shaft, is that right?

i also hear there is somthing called frequency matching as well as spine alignment, or are thoose two in the same thing.

[xix]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

Tipping a shaft is another term for trimming.

You have to trim the tip section of most shafts prior to installing them into a head.
You can then butt trim the assembled club to the desired playing length.

The amount you trim off the tip depends on what flex you want to make the shaft and what number of club the shaft is going into (3 iron will have less trimmed off the tip than an 8 iron).
Most manufacturers will provide you with trimming instructions for their shafts.

[lgskywalker37]

Re: Proper position of spined shaft?

There is no point in buying shafts that have been spined but not tipped, as I've seen the spine move after tipping.

i don't understand??? to build a club you have to tip it, so then how could you spine a club but not tip it? spining is reccomended, but not required, but it sounds liek tipping is required