How many of you have lost your game ?

[buteman]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

Buteman,

Listen close, I think I can help you because you describe all the makings of someone (used to be me) that swings too far from the inside.

The hooks, the fat irons, the shanks, and the 90 round from nowhere from a low handicap player.

Its not rythm, its not your "overactive right hand", or swinging too hard or any of the other non sense you may read on golf channel or digest. Get you swing plane straightened out. The swing is an arc, approach from the inside squaring at impact and back to the inside after separation.

I would bet your divots all face right to well right of your target too. Trust me, I was you for 2-3 years until I uncovered the real reason.

If you could post a video of your swing that would help. Be good


JB

JBrunk,
Thanks for your input, amazing that you seemed to find most of the problem without seeing the swing but definately you are on the right track. Another brutal round yesterday ( 94 ) I'm averaging 15 shots a round higher than what I should be shooting on a reasonable day.
After my round it was straight to the practice facility with the pro. after hitting a few seven irons, hybrids and driver he said, in simple terms, " 94 you shot today, it's a ####### wonder you managed to break 100 " divots well to the right ( as you said ) swing plane, out, in, out. Biggest flaw was alignment and ball position, he said that I had such a fear of hooking the ball that I was aiming so far right of my target, no way anything is going to change.
With the exception of the driver I was playing the ball in the middle ( or further back ) in my stance. Between that and aiming so far right with a closed stance there was absolutely nowhere for the ball to go except left, I was encouraging that. So this was how we went about fixing this, shoulders, hips, knees and feet aimed right down the target line. Irons and hybrids positioned well up in the stance, the takeaway is one piece slightly inside, a smooth backswing, and he had me work on my right shoulder moving down ( not out as I had been doing ).
It was no magical fix, just pure and simple basics, I was out of position trying to fight a hook ( and pull ) and what I was doing was making matters worse. The arc of my swing now is like night and day compared to what it was, I'm approaching from the inside, how right you are when it comes to the arc. So now it's practice, practice, my next game will be early Sunday ( and get home early to see who dons the green jacket ) I'll take this to the course and just let it happen, I'll let you know how it goes. I appreciate your advice ( and other forum members also ) Thanks, Buteman.

[cyc53870]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

When you consider how great pros like Ballesteros and Duval could lose their game, it gets scary indeed... Talent could be inexplicable and fleeting. That being said I still think that golf is generally a game that allows you to improve with time and proper practice, especially the short game... Undoubtedly the most difficult two-handed outdoor sport in the world...

Millions join every year and find out how difficult it really is (Tiger unintentionally fooled 'em into thinking it was easy?) and so sadly millions also quit the game after a few weeks... I say never quit, accept the challenge and have fun.

[Cliff]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

The best way to sort it is.

1/ Take a three week break from the game

2/ Then sell your clubs and play another sport!

Until we learn that this game is as unforgiving as any other sport, that includes the other sex! Take that how you like haha. We will feel down and out when things are not right, like you hit a tree and finished in the lake, (The other guy finished back on the green! I hate this game)

Hey that’s life. But when you clear the mind and concentrate (your in the zone so to speak) you are well on your way to recovery and the confidence lost will be regained and maybe even strengthen your game beyond your dreams.

Try having a pint of beer before you go out next time. And relax/be at ease.

Regards Cliff

[jbrunk]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

JBrunk,
Thanks for your input, amazing that you seemed to find most of the problem without seeing the swing but definately you are on the right track. Another brutal round yesterday ( 94 ) I'm averaging 15 shots a round higher than what I should be shooting on a reasonable day.
After my round it was straight to the practice facility with the pro. after hitting a few seven irons, hybrids and driver he said, in simple terms, " 94 you shot today, it's a ####### wonder you managed to break 100 " divots well to the right ( as you said ) swing plane, out, in, out. Biggest flaw was alignment and ball position, he said that I had such a fear of hooking the ball that I was aiming so far right of my target, no way anything is going to change.
With the exception of the driver I was playing the ball in the middle ( or further back ) in my stance. Between that and aiming so far right with a closed stance there was absolutely nowhere for the ball to go except left, I was encouraging that. So this was how we went about fixing this, shoulders, hips, knees and feet aimed right down the target line. Irons and hybrids positioned well up in the stance, the takeaway is one piece slightly inside, a smooth backswing, and he had me work on my right shoulder moving down ( not out as I had been doing ).
It was no magical fix, just pure and simple basics, I was out of position trying to fight a hook ( and pull ) and what I was doing was making matters worse. The arc of my swing now is like night and day compared to what it was, I'm approaching from the inside, how right you are when it comes to the arc. So now it's practice, practice, my next game will be early Sunday ( and get home early to see who dons the green jacket ) I'll take this to the course and just let it happen, I'll let you know how it goes. I appreciate your advice ( and other forum members also ) Thanks, Buteman.

Can you clarify the right shoulder down vs out comment? I may be misunderstanding.

My moment of clarity came when I learned that my shoulder was going straight down (too far inside on approach), and I had to learn what it felt like to go out a little and then down. This is what I would expect the pro to tell you.

It is kind of strange and hard to explain, but I had to learn it by mastering the sit down move at transition while I held my hands "back" or "up", then I would snap my left leg straight at the same time as my right shoulder started down the plane.

I have not hit a hook or even more than a 10 yard draw in months. Actually, I am trying to work on a move where I can draw the ball some. That is how good the swing plane fix worked.

Best of luck.

JB

[BrianW]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

yea, i lost my game all the time. I'v gone from a 90 to a 115, then got better, and then went back up to 110sih. REcently i went from 70's to 125! It is quite frustrating, but i just keep at it and usually get better and learn what i did that made me loose my game, so it won't happen to me again. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger, same with my game, what doesn't kill it (though very badly damaging it at times) i learn from and get that much better. just keep at it, slow things down and try to think what you are doing and where you went wrong and try different things.

Nicely put!

[buteman]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

Jbrunk : To answer your question regarding the " right shoulder down " what the pro. was looking at was a move I was making at the start of the downswing.
My right shoulder was moving out not down, this was eliminating any ability to stay behind the ball as I was entering the impact area. With my driver and longer clubs this move made me come into the ball with a closed face or my weight was way over on the right side too soon causing me to hit the ball with the face open at impact.
As I had mentioned before the most serious issue I had was alignment, it was so far out of whack. After he adjusted the alignment as I stood at address it certainly appeared to me I was aiming well left of target. The shaft of my driver was laid down and when I looked at this line I was exactly lined up.
Prior to the adjustment although I felt that I was aiming just right of the target it was quickly pointed out to me ( and shown ) that ( at the practice range ) my target being the 150 yard marker, I was actually lined up at least 20 yards right of the target.
That combined with a closed stance was deadly, as the pro. said " the only place the ball can go is hard left with that setup". He also wanted my right elbow close to my body during my downswing instead of the " throwing out " move I was making. All of this was causing severe hooks, pulls, fat shots and loss of distance, as far as the shanks were concerned on short wedge shots he took a good look at that.
His first comment was " you are crowding the ball to the point your almost stepping on it " a quick inside takeaway fanning the club wide open with practically no chance of squaring the face at impact. There is nothing more important ( IMO ) when you are struggling with chronic swing issues than the trained eye, in my particular case this short lesson not only gave me something to work on to correct the issues involved but after a number of well struck balls confidence started to return.
I will end by saying this, the issues were plainly pointed out to me and I understood the points being made. I have an early tee off time tomorrow and I will NOT be shooting in the mid nineties with the knowledge I have. I'm perfectly capable of shooting in the seventies on any given day, probably not tomorrow but who knows, at least the door has been opened for me. I'm sure you will agree how important plain basics are when it comes to executing good golf shots. Regards, Buteman.

[GreeBoman]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

I think the biggest cause of a total deterioration of the golf swing is lack of weight transfer, or worse still, the reverse-pivot.
It all goes pear-shaped when you reverse-pivot, out to in swing path, fat, thin, loss of distance, direction, you name it in fact.

I find swinging with my feet @ 8 inches apart fixes me up most of the time, you have to transfer your weight with a narrow stance or you will fall over

[Ian Hancock]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

Sorry if I repeat what may have already been posted as I have not read all the replies.

Sometimes we think we loose out swing but infact once you learn it, to coin a phrase 'like riding a bike, we never forget'.

What actually happens is purely brain related and nothing to to with technic.

Firstly, You may hit a few bad shots, maybe shanks or just really bad results, massive slice etc..............This is where it goes from you completely, you then instantly start thinking of every position.........is my grip right, takeaway, then bang TENTION once you have tention you may as well pack up and go home, you become a control freak trying to control the club head, inevitably swinging slower, which makes it worse, tention shrinks the body too, like sucking in your tummy.

There isn't really a cure for this at all, it is a simple case of prevention, like every golfer across the globe we all try to stay relaxed, like Brian mentions earlier he had the shanks, just finish the round best you can then go to the range next day and "they are gone" if you forget it and just put it down to a few bad swings.

A carpenter hits nails with a hammer everyday of his career, but he still misses the nail every now and then, probably says to himself "what's up with me" can't hit a bloody nail straight today.

The moral is sometimes we are not the same, whenever my swing 'goes' it's usually because I start swinging a little slower with more control, sometimes I get a mental block with say the driver, I can hit every club in the bag fine but then tention creeps in soon as I get on the tee.

The answer: easy to say......just forget it, relax and focus on hitting the ball to a target, nothing more.

P.S. for thoses interested I have just read 3SKs for the 5th time, about every two months just to recap what I want to do and focus on.


Thanks

Ian.

[pnearn]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

Buteman,

Listen close, I think I can help you because you describe all the makings of someone (used to be me) that swings too far from the inside.

The hooks, the fat irons, the shanks, and the 90 round from nowhere from a low handicap player.

Its not rythm, its not your "overactive right hand", or swinging too hard or any of the other non sense you may read on golf channel or digest. Get you swing plane straightened out. The swing is an arc, approach from the inside squaring at impact and back to the inside after separation.

I would bet your divots all face right to well right of your target too. Trust me, I was you for 2-3 years until I uncovered the real reason.

If you could post a video of your swing that would help. Be good


JB

I 100% agree. When I struggle its with going left and its always because my swing path is OK (in to out) but im rolling the hands/casting/flipping/hitting from the top - whatever you want to call it. I stop turning and use my hands and that mean thins, pushes, hooks

I go back to half swings just feeling like I pull the clubhead through the ball to the right, with quiet hands/loose grip and feeling lmy left wrist stays flat and I hit down on the ball with the the back of my left hand. Im conscious personally of not trying to steepen the plane as I dont think thats my problem - its the use of my hands

I've worked for 2 years to get the hands out of it and stop flipping but I still fight it

[BrianW]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

There is so much that can go wrong with a golf swing and annoyingly most of these things are small errors that can creep in but result in almost complete game melt down.

Sometimes there is no instant on course fix other than eliminating certain shots or clubs to finish the game until you can get to the range or a lesson and work through it.

I have two drills or swing thoughts that I call on. The first is to make some easy swings with my feet together, this restores my tempo and gets me balanced and centred in the swing (otherwise you fall over) The second is to focus on swinging the toe of the club right through impact, this encourages me to make a full rotation and release, many swing faults can be created by giving in on the shot.

Anyhow! That's the way I deal with my game going south

[jambalaya]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

Buteman,

Listen close, I think I can help you because you describe all the makings of someone (used to be me) that swings too far from the inside.

The hooks, the fat irons, the shanks, and the 90 round from nowhere from a low handicap player.

Its not rythm, its not your "overactive right hand", or swinging too hard or any of the other non sense you may read on golf channel or digest. Get you swing plane straightened out. The swing is an arc, approach from the inside squaring at impact and back to the inside after separation.

I would bet your divots all face right to well right of your target too. Trust me, I was you for 2-3 years until I uncovered the real reason.

If you could post a video of your swing that would help. Be good


JB

Sound reasoning. I know that last few times a round went into the ****per for me as far as ball striking this was the cause. As soon as I checked my swing plane and got it more upright good things happened.

[ThePuttKing65]

Re: How many of you have lost your game ?

My game never goes seriously wrong. I've just looked through my golf diary. I've played 98 holes without a double bogey or worse. All birdies, pars and bogeys !

I once started shanking about 20 years ago. It completely dented my confidence and even when I sorted it out my scores were still about 10 shots worse !