how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo open!!

[jambalaya]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

Have you ever had lessons? I'll bet you could have this straightened out pretty quick with a first hand look.

[medici999]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

[BrianW]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

Look at these two golfers as they come into impact, their left arms are straight, hands ahead of ball, right hands holding a cupped position, shoulders almost square, head behind ball, weight onto front leg. It's the moment of truth, if you work on anything work on attaining this position.

[medici999]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

yer, but my lessons have been trying to get me stopping coming ott.

[BrianW]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

yer, but my lessons have been trying to get me stopping coming ott.

You seem to have changed your mind here. The OP was asking for help on open hips and shoulders at impact, you are now referring to an out to in swing and coming OTT.

What would you like help with please?

[medici999]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

i always thought it was my overactive hips and shoulders that caused the ott.

im just looking for help in general, but i now know i just need to keep practising and learn how to retain the wrist angles! oh...and a bit of axis tilt would be nice.

[pnearn]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

i always thought it was my overactive hips and shoulders that caused the ott.

im just looking for help in general, but i now know i just need to keep practising and learn how to retain the wrist angles! oh...and a bit of axis tilt would be nice.

You are coming OT and coming out of your spine angle a little because you are hitting from the top. This is also probably why you dont move the hips from the top because your instinct is always to with the right hand first

Think about it. If you bump your hips left which will shift weight (and get you axis tilt) and then rotate your body, you will turn your shoulders. Now as you do this if you also keep a flat left wrist the clubhead will stay behind those turning shoulders. As soon as you go at the ball with your right hand you will move the clubhead forward and out -OTT. Keep that left wrist flat/right wrist cupped and you wont

The problem (i know as it took me months to get the hands and hit out of my swing) is from the top you want to use that right hand, you want to pull it down or move it forward or aim right and turn it over or whatever. Thats your instinct. Thus you cant get the hips to go forward first because your brain is screaming 'right hand'!. You need to do those drills I posted earlier a lot with the feeling that the left hips pulls those wrists down and aroubd into the back of the ball. You will get the asix tilt doing this and your right shoulder will go 'down plane'. But i wouldnt worry about that stuff for now just work on those wrists. L-L drills with a PW is a great way to start. You'll find when you do this right the swing is effortless, its all body, all turn and no hands

So to reiterate your hips and shoulders are fine. Its your hands taking the club OTT. To quote the manzella crowd - educate your hands

[jambalaya]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

One last comment. When I played your video I tried to do some quick clicks to stop it at certain points. I got it to stop several times when you had the club at about hip high or a little before hip high. It seems to me that the club head was outside the target line at those points. I could be totally wrong but it doesn't seem you are bringing the club to the inside soon enough. Of course there are golfers like Fred Couples who do that but they have a compensating move or a different grip or something that allows them to get the club back to sqaure. Generally the club should start to the inside right away for a more conventional swing. Just another angle to consider. As if you needed any more.

[medici999]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

lol.. thanks. i cant get the club upright unless i take it outside a little bit, otherwise my arms just get real deep. im working on keeping a flat left wrist, but just cant to the hip bump atm!!

[jambalaya]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

lol.. thanks. i cant get the club upright unless i take it outside a little bit, otherwise my arms just get real deep. im working on keeping a flat left wrist, but just cant to the hip bump atm!!

Yeah, I have trouble bumping the hip too. At least I think so. If bumping the hip has to be a conscious thought I'm screwed. Everything else seems to go all to hell when I think about bumping the hip. I think of it more as setting the left leg so I can turn on it. If there is a hip bump in there somewhere then fine.

[medici999]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

someone said to me that i should practice unwinding my left leg counter clockwise to the target too....had 2 awful rounds today, shot 89, 87 of a 5handicap!!

[prowlsta]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

Think I have the same problem as you except Ive countered it by weakening my grip and hit a pull fade.

Im having a lesson this weekend so will let you know what the pro says.

Do you find it effects your short game? Im really struggling for any kind of consistency when Im not hitting a full shot.

J

[AvidGolfer]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

Think I have the same problem as you except Ive countered it by weakening my grip and hit a pull fade.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuaeHMMqio8

Im having a lesson this weekend so will let you know what the pro says.

Do you find it effects your short game? Im really struggling for any kind of consistency when Im not hitting a full shot.

J

Good luck with your lesson this weekend. Hopefully it will go well for you. If not here are my thoughts on your swing based on the video(s) you posted.


I've taken a couple of screen captures from your video and added some lines (linked below):
http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/2319/prowlstaow9.jpg
I've also taken 2008 Masters Champion Trevor Immelman and drew lines on him as well for comparison.
Immelman downline:
http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/6...ownlinegp6.jpg
Immelman face:
http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/3...manfacepd3.jpg

Downline Analysis:
Setup downline:
Your setup from down the line looks good except it appears your weight may be too far toward your toes (and/or you may be tilted forward a little too much). The white line extends up from the balls of the feet through the knee caps and the back of the shoulders on Immelman, but with you your shoulders are farther away from the line suggesting that your weight is too far toward the ball.

Hip high back downline:
As you swing back to hip high from down the line we see that your hands are just about on the plane line while your clubhead is swing under it, and your shoulders are tilting toward the ground. In Immelman's swing at the same point we see the hands and clubhead just about on the plane line (very slightly above it), and his shoulders are making a more level turn around his tilted spine.

Top of swing downline:
The shoulder tilt you made earlier is still apparent, but your arms are still able to arrive in a good position at the top. The left arm is paralllel to the original shaft angle plane, and the right arm is parallel to your spine angle.

Downswing downline:
On the downswing we see that parts of your body (legs and knees) that were on the left side of the balance line are now moving to the right side of the line (your body is trying to establish balance). If you look at Immelman comming down you will see that he keeps the same amount of his body on each side of the line during the downswing as he had at address.

Impact downline:
Since your body moved across the balance line your arms are cramped and blocked at impact. At the same time Immelman has room for his hands, arms, and club to swing freely into and through impact because he has the same distribution of body parts on each side of the line as he did at address.

Face on Analysis:
Setup face on:
I have drawn a green line straight up from the ball. As you can see on your setup image the line goes through your right eye, and half of your body is on the target side of the line. If you look at Immelman you will see the green line extends up to his left ear, and the only things to the target side of the line is his left shoulder, left arm (aside from hand) including the elbow, left hip, left leg including the knee, and left foot. Since so much of him is behind the ball at setup he has an easy time getting behind the ball during the swing, and staying behind it comming down. To get your body more behind the ball at setup you could tilt your spine away from the target and get the ball lined up with your left ear.

Backswing face on:
As mentioned from the down the line view your shoulders tilt. You weight looks to stay on your left side and over the ball. Immelman meanwhile moves his arms and torso in sync and coils behind the ball.

Downswing face on:
Your head and torso move in front of the line (toward the taget), and (like in the down the line view) we see you get jammed. Immelman moves his left shoulder and hip toward the target, and then his body clears behind him while his head stays behind the line (until it is pulled through near the finish).

Hope that (over detailed) analysis helps you out. Now you have the information needed to take your game to the next level and turn pro.

[prowlsta]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

Thanks Avid,
Will see what the pro says and let you know if he picks up on any of these points!! Its the same coach that Andrew Coltart uses so he should be a good one!

I got told at my last video lesson that my swing was (unwittingly) a stack and tilt swing ( to be honest I hadnt even heard of a stack and tilt swing before reading it on this website).

Any change that might improve my game would be worth it!

[bahamaman]

Re: how to get more closed at impact!! hips and shoulders soooo soooooooooooooooo ope

A quick fix that I found that will compact your swing is to keep your right elbow tucked into your right side on the back swing and forget lifting your arms too high in the air. That will alone keep your arms and shoulders from swinging outside in. You may loose a little distance though until you groove it. Just remember to fully rotate your shoulder turn at least 90 degrees. Remember that sometimes it may seem that you are rotating the shoulders because the shaft is perpendicular to the ground. Not necessarily so. Check to see if your left shoulder is below you chin.
2008 Most Improved Golfer Tahoe Paradise GC. 10.2 handicap.