Distance Question

[cyc53870]

I got a question that needs answering or I might go nuts thinking about it...

How come Lorena Ochoa, height 5'6" and 127 lbs. can hit the ball 290 yards?

It must mean proper technique, eh?

[BrianW]

Re: Distance Question

Yes, it's technique. It certainly is not a powerful body move and it is not massive biceps.

In my modest opinion () fast head speed can be generated by the use of the arms and wrists accelerating the clubhead through impact and you don't need to be a gorilla to do it. Slowing down and reducing the arc of the hands in a way that accelerates the club through impact is something that not many understand but can create effortless power.

If you want an insight to this then read my article and watch the video.

http://www.golf-tuition-online.com/c...l#post10555915

There is another method to boost your swing further, I have tried to explain the method on another post but it involves a method that many consider unworkable as it involves pushing the right hand under the left which resembles swatting the wrists. I will leave that one as it is somewhat controversial.

I hope that the article helps you to understand.

[bill reed]

Re: Distance Question

hi
if you watch Lorena Ochoa you will see she is very much a swinger rather than a hitter and the body and arms and hands all work together in a very smooth way. no jerks or sharp movements. no knee kick or anything like that. it all timing and rhythm. her Ping driver and shaft help too.
if you watch KJ Choi he seems to swing the same way where there is very little body movement and everything seems so smooth.
cheers
bill

[jambalaya]

Re: Distance Question

Lorena takes a very big swing. She is very flexible and gets a lot of coil in her body. She turns those shoulders way back and has great extension creating a very wide arc with which to build up swing speed. She accellerates beautifully through the ball. She is a two plane swinger and gets her arms up high in the backswing and the club just past parallel. Most of us just don't have the timing for such a big swing.

[cyc53870]

Re: Distance Question

Most of us just don't have the timing for such a big swing.

The mystery deepens. Whoever unlocks the secret of the effortless long drive AND is able to pass it along easily to just about ANY student will make a fortune. But in the past 50 (100?) years such a thing has not surfaced.
So it may be impossible then.

This will be one of top dozen questions in the afterlife then... How just a relative few lucky people can swing so naturally far which is why golf remains such a difficult sport despite science and technology, etc. My best guess is that these people must have at least 80% fast-twitch muscles... Or the equivalent of an athletic talented golf gene...

Oh well, back to experimenting with the swing... Even if we know that you can't change your swing, just tinker with it a little bit, eh?

I will also check out the site mentioned
http://www.golf-tuition-online.com/c...l#post10555915 (Plane and Path 111)

[BrianW]

Re: Distance Question

The mystery deepens. Whoever unlocks the secret of the effortless long drive AND is able to pass it along easily to just about ANY student will make a fortune. But in the past 50 (100?) years such a thing has not surfaced.
So it may be impossible then.

This will be one of top dozen questions in the afterlife then... How just a relative few lucky people can swing so naturally far which is why golf remains such a difficult sport despite science and technology, etc. My best guess is that these people must have at least 80% fast-twitch muscles... Or the equivalent of an athletic talented golf gene...

Oh well, back to experimenting with the swing... Even if we know that you can't change your swing, just tinker with it a little bit, eh?

I will also check out the site mentioned
http://www.golf-tuition-online.com/c...l#post10555915 (Plane and Path 111)

It works for me I am 60 years old and can still hit a fair drive without splitting any ribs.

[cyc53870]

Re: Distance Question

Perhaps Ochoa had an early start at a young age into golf... Maybe that's the secret, eh? Start young at age 3 or 5... Bad news for us late starters...

Any late starters out there?

[bill reed]

Re: Distance Question

hi
L Ochoa is not to bad a football player as she showed when she played a charity game during the Evian Masters.
she said after being Mexican there first love is football.
its refreshing having someone with such a nice personality also being one of the best women golfs and had already won 2 majors and 10 pga in her first year and a half.
but still M Wie gets more publicity and it the golden girl of womens golf and claimed to the "Tiger" of womens golf but not won a thing so far.
i think the have it the wrong way round.
cheers
bill

[ubizmo]

Re: Distance Question

This will be one of top dozen questions in the afterlife then... How just a relative few lucky people can swing so naturally far which is why golf remains such a difficult sport despite science and technology, etc. My best guess is that these people must have at least 80% fast-twitch muscles... Or the equivalent of an athletic talented golf gene...

I think you're onto something, concerning the likely preponderance of FT muscle fibers. In any sport requiring short-duration bursts of exertion, those with a lot of FT have an advantage. This is why not just any massive guy can be a good (American) football linebacker. Not only do those guys have to be big, but they must move explosively, and the ability to do that has a lot to do with FT muscle. With the golf swing, a lot of FT muscle means that clubhead speed can be generated quickly, and it will *look* relatively effortless. Obviously, at the top levels of the game, technique plays a huge part too. But if you consider Lorena Ochoa and Corey Pavin, we can assume that both of them have superb technique. Nevertheless, Ochoa tends to drive the ball farther than Pavin. What explains that? I doubt it comes down to what we usually think of as strength. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Ochoa has a much higher density of FT muscle.

I guess it's all academic, but there is a lesson in it. If you're making good contact with the ball but still not getting immense distance, it doesn't mean you're doing something wrong. And if you try to swing faster than what your FT muscles will naturally support, you'll almost certainly end up convulsing your body in other ways that will result in worse contact and less distance. This is why we all occasionally, or even regularly, have the weird experience of getting better distance when it feels like we didn't make much of an effort at all.

[pnearn]

Re: Distance Question

I got a question that needs answering or I might go nuts thinking about it...

How come Lorena Ochoa, height 5'6" and 127 lbs. can hit the ball 290 yards?

It must mean proper technique, eh?

You answered your own question

[kbp]

Re: Distance Question

It has very, very little to do with the proportion of so called "fast twitch" muscles. It has everything to do with her technique and using her legs, hips and core to drive her hands and arms along the correct path with as little manipulation as possible and having the timing to allow an unforced, natural release with maximum speed.

In light of other threads on body vs. arms or whatever, it should be obvious that for a small person with a small upper body such as Ochoa to be hitting the further than many men, SHE is NOT doing it with her arms and hands as the predominant source of power.

It also helps when you learn this at an age when you’re too small to "muscle" the club around and are forced to swing it with your body. Once you can use your legs hips and core to move your hands, arms, and club on the right path, you can turn very hard and power with the body without fear of getting off plane or timing a make-up move with your hands and arms. You can also hit very hard with the hands and arms, if you like, once they have already been set in motion on the correct path and everything is driving in a manner that is not forcing them off path.

Unfortunately, most of us are not putting that kind of move on the ball. We are forced to hold back, manipulate, time, subjugate the lower body to the upper body or vice versa, do this that and the other thing to keep us from running off the track. Myself (frequently) included.

[cyc53870]

Re: Distance Question

Unfortunately, most of us are not putting that kind of move on the ball. We are forced to hold back, manipulate, time, subjugate the lower body to the upper body or vice versa, do this that and the other thing to keep us from running off the track. Myself (frequently) included.

Then how come proper technique can not be taught by the pros to us amateurs... the golf magazines don't hardly mention this. Is there a real magic move to unlock it? Why can't golf be taught properly like other sports?

[bill reed]

Re: Distance Question

hi
i think one thing that is hardly covered in magazines is the importance of hitting the ball in the sweet spot. all pros work on there ball striking and have the ability to put the club face onto the ball in a half inch of the sweet spot time after time. but is you look at the impact on impact tape of most handicap players it all over the place. you will never get that maximum distance hitting the ball more than 3/4 of an inch from the sweet spot.
how many of us work on hitting the ball on the sweet spot and checking it on impact tape.
working on your ball striking but not working on where the ball makes contact on the club face seems to be self defeating to me.
when learning to hit the ball in a half inch of the the sweet spot you have to slow your swing a bit and work on the proper impact and then when you can hit that impact zone time after time then you can speed up your swing speed.you will find you get more distance without effort.
cheers
bill

[BrianW]

Re: Distance Question

I will refer again to a small weight on the end of a piece of string. Spin it around while held between your thumb and forefinger.

If you want the weight to rotate slowly what must you do?
If you want the weight to spin as fast as possible what must you do? Try it! Our brain understands this without anyone having to explain it.

The backswing cannot create impact head speed. The downswing cannot produce suitable impact head speed until the hands are near the bottom of the arc. The answer to hitting the ball far is revealed to us with the string and weight. The small inner arc creates a fast outer arc!

Think about the Trebuchet. The speed that projects the final lever is created when the arm slows and stops, consider the long wooden shaft as our arm, the joint to the rope as our wrist, the rope as the clubshaft.

[bill reed]

Re: Distance Question

hi Brian
i think your Trebuchet is a good example.
it has a slow moving spine like your hips movement and turn and the hinge is passive ie "the rope" like the way your wrists work.
it is similar to the ping man or the iron byron golf robot.
cheers
bill