Driver has carry but no roll?

[mariner]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

"I drive off with my playing partners, we all pitch at a similar distance . . . . theirs' roll another 20 yards, mine stops dead or even ends up a yard behind it's pitchmark! "

Perhaps Mariner can explain the above statement.
Ted

Sure - my drives don't roll as much as I'd like, if at all.

[mariner]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

Thanks Brian W - that article seems to be just what I need, I am going to the range this afternoon to put that into practice.
It all makes obvious sense, apart from the 45 degree angle bit, I mean I'm sure it's right, but it's not immediately obvious why . . . . and I like to address the ball with the clubshaft and my left arm in a straight line, which means that the butt end of the club will probably be too high.
I hasten to add that this is not the determining factor though as I've only recently started doing that and I got the same high flight with no roll when my hands were lower.

[BrianW]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

Thanks Brian W - that article seems to be just what I need, I am going to the range this afternoon to put that into practice.
It all makes obvious sense, apart from the 45 degree angle bit, I mean I'm sure it's right, but it's not immediately obvious why . . . . and I like to address the ball with the clubshaft and my left arm in a straight line, which means that the butt end of the club will probably be too high.
I hasten to add that this is not the determining factor though as I've only recently started doing that and I got the same high flight with no roll when my hands were lower.

The 45 Deg is the recommended angle the club shaft should make with the ground at address to stop your swing plane being too flat or steep.

[dagosa]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

I drive off with my playing partners, we all pitch at a similar distance . . . . theirs' roll another 20 yards, mine stops dead or even ends up a yard behind it's pitchmark!
I must be putting excessive spin on it, and I know I need to catch it on the upswing to prevent this, but can't seem to do it.
I hit very straight with a 12 degree offset driver and am 14h/c

Had similar problem with high loft oversize driver of 12 degree. That, along with up swing produced same results. I gave a used 8.5 degree Titleist 983E a try and fell in love with it and will never go back to the oversize high loft again. Some people's swing aren't made for them and not messing with your swing may be a better way. Heck, the pros. are doing it more now. (changing drivers instead of swings) If you're hitting it strait with good flight distance, I wouldn't mess with my swing, but give a try to changing lower loft club.

[Neil18]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

How about a fresh approach?

I'm not sure that knowing in your analytical mind how you put lots of spin on it will help your produce a flatter ball flight, or show your physical self how to hit a flat drive. In golf, mind knowing doesn't necessarily equal body doing.

Flattening your drive is what you're looking for, I think. More energy put into sending the ball forward than spinning it and ballooning it. What doesn't go into spinning the ball will go into straight-line power.

Just spend some time with an empty mind and see how many different ways you can send a flat-liner out there. Then you'll not only have figured out how to hit a piercing one that rolls, you'll also find loads of other ways of hitting a ton of both desirable and undesirable shots. And you've always got your spinning high one that lands soft for those times when there's not much fairway. After all, you know what hitting one of thsoe feels like.

At least you're working toward something positive. Knowing why you do what you do now is still centred on what you want to change, not what you want to change it to. World of difference.

[BrianW]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

How about a fresh approach?

I'm not sure that knowing in your analytical mind how you put lots of spin on it will help your produce a flatter ball flight, or show your physical self how to hit a flat drive. In golf, mind knowing doesn't necessarily equal body doing.

Flattening your drive is what you're looking for, I think. More energy put into sending the ball forward than spinning it and ballooning it. What doesn't go into spinning the ball will go into straight-line power.

Just spend some time with an empty mind and see how many different ways you can send a flat-liner out there. Then you'll not only have figured out how to hit a piercing one that rolls, you'll also find loads of other ways of hitting a ton of both desirable and undesirable shots. And you've always got your spinning high one that lands soft for those times when there's not much fairway. After all, you know what hitting one of thsoe feels like.

At least you're working toward something positive. Knowing why you do what you do now is still centred on what you want to change, not what you want to change it to. World of difference.

Neil,

I think he needs to send the ball high with low spin to max his carry and roll.

[Neil18]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

Comprende Brian.

Same rules apply!

Maybe taking the ball low to get the other end of the spectrum first, then working back form there may help? If it's anything like my learning curve, taking it to the extreme then working back from there gives the biggest feeling of change. It's very easy, I'm sure you know, to think you're doing different, and in actual fact not change a thing.

[dagosa]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

Comprende Brian.

Same rules apply!

Maybe taking the ball low to get the other end of the spectrum first, then working back form there may help? If it's anything like my learning curve, taking it to the extreme then working back from there gives the biggest feeling of change. It's very easy, I'm sure you know, to think you're doing different, and in actual fact not change a thing.

A golfer with accuracy and plenty of ball flight....don't mess with the swing, change the club. 12 degrees is problematic at some point as a distance producer. Over time, your driver swing can improve making the dependence on such counter productive. The groove-less face of a driver has much less control over spin than it does over launch angle than any other club. I would like his problem...that distance is under better control than his mates. Highly recommend carrying two drivers...I do. A large face 12 degreeshort steel shaft driver for high ball flight, minimum roll and better distance control...and the all out 9 degree to max the distance.
I hate hitting fairway woods off tees and would rather use a "short" 12 degree driver for that purpose. So my strong 3 fairway wood and 12 driver have the same distance...different use.

[mariner]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

A lot of posts telling me not to mess with my swing, but change the driver . . . . . I WISH I'd read them before going to the range last night!!!!!
I was trying the different set-up position to try and maximise my roll, with the result that I feel I've lost my swing completely now. I was just struggling to get back to how it was before half way through the session.
This game is really sent to test you isn't it?
All I got by leaning back, dropping the right shoulder and teeing the ball high off my front foot was the flight of a 9 iron pulled 40 degrees to the left. I persevered, but not a single one came off right, so I panicked and tried to go back to my "normal" swing, and pfft!. . . . . . it was gone.
I'm playing a society day Monday and will have to go to the range again before then just to try to get back to square one, just to FIND the drawing board!

[dagosa]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

A lot of posts telling me not to mess with my swing, but change the driver . . . . . I WISH I'd read them before going to the range last night!!!!!
I was trying the different set-up position to try and maximise my roll, with the result that I feel I've lost my swing completely now. I was just struggling to get back to how it was before half way through the session.
This game is really sent to test you isn't it?
All I got by leaning back, dropping the right shoulder and teeing the ball high off my front foot was the flight of a 9 iron pulled 40 degrees to the left. I persevered, but not a single one came off right, so I panicked and tried to go back to my "normal" swing, and pfft!. . . . . . it was gone.
I'm playing a society day Monday and will have to go to the range again before then just to try to get back to square one, just to FIND the drawing board!

Not to worry....I feel we are capable of regaining anything we had. It will come back as soon as it left as you revert back to old swing thoughts and habits. If it was consistent before, it will be again. I think it's fun to experiment and use a little trial and error. How else can you improve ? All instructors I know expect slippage with any change you make...
But make only one change at a time...and I would recommend the club to be the first

[BrianW]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

A lot of posts telling me not to mess with my swing, but change the driver . . . . . I WISH I'd read them before going to the range last night!!!!!
I was trying the different set-up position to try and maximise my roll, with the result that I feel I've lost my swing completely now. I was just struggling to get back to how it was before half way through the session.
This game is really sent to test you isn't it?
All I got by leaning back, dropping the right shoulder and teeing the ball high off my front foot was the flight of a 9 iron pulled 40 degrees to the left. I persevered, but not a single one came off right, so I panicked and tried to go back to my "normal" swing, and pfft!. . . . . . it was gone.
I'm playing a society day Monday and will have to go to the range again before then just to try to get back to square one, just to FIND the drawing board!

It will take a lot more than one range session to make a reliable swing change.

[mariner]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

If I use a 10 degree driver the trade off seems to be 20% longer, 20% less accurate and I'd rather stick with the accuracy.
I didn't consider a set-up change to be a major swing change so I would have expected to catch a few correctly, not mishit absolutely everything in a totally unacceptable manner, and if you are saying this change needs hours of range sessions, then I'm not prepared to do it, I'll just be short and accurate and work on my sort game instead!
It's a good idea to go to extremes and work your way back I know, but I can't hit a low ball (unless I top it) to save my life.

[rotator]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

Hi Mariner,

I sympathize with your acceptance of continuing o use the higher loft driver versus changing your swing or going for a lower lofted driver and losing accuracy.

That does, however, leave the simpler alternative of seeking a ball which spins less for your equipment and swing.

Good hunting,

Ted

[dagosa]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

If I use a 10 degree driver the trade off seems to be 20% longer, 20% less accurate and I'd rather stick with the accuracy.
I didn't consider a set-up change to be a major swing change so I would have expected to catch a few correctly, not mishit absolutely everything in a totally unacceptable manner, and if you are saying this change needs hours of range sessions, then I'm not prepared to do it, I'll just be short and accurate and work on my sort game instead!
It's a good idea to go to extremes and work your way back I know, but I can't hit a low ball (unless I top it) to save my life.

Throwing a 9 plus degree driver in the bag and using it on "expanded" fairways...with use you will become acceptably accurate. The pros do this with their clubs all the time. We hit our "drivers" of the tee much more than they do... while they often use clubs equal to your 12 degree. 20% increase in distance is dramatic and worth working with IMO, if only occasionally.
Why so many feel compelled to hit their driver all the time, I'll never understand. Let your 12 degree be your short accurate " strong 3 ".

[mariner]

Re: Driver has carry but no roll?

Hi Mariner,
That does, however, leave the simpler alternative of seeking a ball which spins less for your equipment and swing.

Good hunting,

Ted

Yeah, I put a post on here a month ago about finding out what the longest, lowest spin balls are and have bought a dozen Callaway HX hot reds for tomorrow's society day. I found an old one in amongst my practice balls and used it on my last round but didn't really see much difference - it was old though.
I'll be down the range again at 8.00 to try and find a swing for tomorrow that gets me in the fairway!
It it just me, or does anybody else consider themselves to have three or even four different swings?
I have what I think of as a loose left arm swing that hits an even higher than usual shot with a slight fade . . . . . then I have one where I address the ball with clubshaft and left arm in a straight line and think of going straight back and through on the same more upright plane with the image of a wagon wheel, this is really accurate and straight. Then my third one is a flatter one that feels as if it is just a turn of the upper body with hardly any wrist action, and produces a lower shot that either goes dead straight or draws a little (the "harder" I hit it the more it draws)
I use this last one into the wind when anything high and fadey is useless, but it's not quite so consistent that I could use it as my stock drive all the time as I'm not sure how much it will draw and the odd one gets away to the right!
Then when all is lost and I get despondent, I just walk up to it and smack it wih a full follow through - and you are all expecting me to say that this is the best shot, but it's not, it is the same as my loose left arm one, high with a little fade, but not as accurate, and I wouldn't consider hitting this shot when I am still playing "properly"