Should I try the one-plane-swing?

[rotator]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

Take a look at these links on this google page. They give more info on the one plane swing.

The first one is an old Golf Channel episode that aired many years ago and featured Peter Jacobsen and Jim Hardy. It' s an interesting explanation of the anti OTT benefit of the bent over one plane posture.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&c...-revision&cd=5

Ted

[jbrunk]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

OTT is starting to really, really frustrate me and the harder I try to slow my swing or focus on the first move in the downswing, the worse it gets. A friend has suggested I try the one-plane golfswing as he read on a golf website "If you are aggressive and strong in the chest, abdominals, back and shoulders, the one-plane swing will suit you better."

Anyone agree / disagree and would love to hear anyone who has changed from a two plane to a one-plane swing and if so has it worked for them?

(Im a frustrated 26 handicapper)!!

Ozzie, one plane two plane is a myth IMO as no golfer worth their weight swings the club on the same plane down as they do back. It should be called flat or upright. Neither will 'fix' your OTT move. You come over the top because your clubface is too open.

Good luck in your search.

[BrianW]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

Ozzie, one plane two plane is a myth IMO as no golfer worth their weight swings the club on the same plane down as they do back. It should be called flat or upright. Neither will 'fix' your OTT move. You come over the top because your clubface is too open.

Good luck in your search.

You don't swing on the same plane up and down, you swing on the same path up and down with a one plane or rotary swing. Read Hogans Five lessons and how he imagined a plane of glass from the ball that passed over his shoulders and how you keep the club head under that. I think he was worth his weight just as many modern tour golfers are that swing the club up onto their shoulder plane.

[ozzyollie]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

Ozzie, one plane two plane is a myth IMO as no golfer worth their weight swings the club on the same plane down as they do back. It should be called flat or upright. Neither will 'fix' your OTT move. You come over the top because your clubface is too open.

Good luck in your search.

thanks but I think my OTT is mainly because I'm trying to hit the ball to hard so my arms get out of sync

[BrianW]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

thanks but I think my OTT is mainly because I'm trying to hit the ball to hard so my arms get out of sync

Thats right. You will be hitting from the top and throwing out your right shoulder such that the club comes outside the ball.

Irrespective of what has been said previously the solution is different depending on your swing type.

With a two plane swing you need to start the downswing with a bump and rotation of your hips, you should keep the shoulders turned back a little longer and they will naturally pull down so that your right shoulder works down and under your chin. This will drop the club to the inside where you can then swing it on an inside path to the ball.

With a one plane swing you need to maintain your spine angle, this will prevent your shoulders swinging too upright and flat so the club will rotate from the inside around your stacked spine.

[jbrunk]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

You don't swing on the same plane up and down, you swing on the same path up and down with a one plane or rotary swing. Read Hogans Five lessons and how he imagined a plane of glass from the ball that passed over his shoulders and how you keep the club head under that. I think he was worth his weight just as many modern tour golfers are that swing the club up onto their shoulder plane.

My problem with 1-2 plane swing theory is that it is not a fix for much. I am sure it helps some people, probably the best players who already know how to square the face. It surely will not help a slicer (over the topper). If anything going to a 1 plane swing will make the ott problem worse as it makes the open clubface problem harder to handle.

[BrianW]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

My problem with 1-2 plane swing theory is that it is not a fix for much. I am sure it helps some people, probably the best players who already know how to square the face. It surely will not help a slicer (over the topper). If anything going to a 1 plane swing will make the ott problem worse as it makes the open clubface problem harder to handle.

Can you explain to me how you consider a one plane swing makes the open clubface harder to handle?

IMO open clubface problems are due to either allowing your torso to outrace your arms so that the club lags behind you with an open face. Or, the club does not release properly due to a tight grip or trying to muscle it.

To reiterate: A one plane swing prevents an OTT move, as long as your spine angle is maintained it is not possible to do it.

This previous video explains nicely:

[jbrunk]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

The one plane swing relies more on the body rotation to square the face. The slicer (and most amatuers) needs to learn to square the face more with the hands because it just doesn't happen naturally for the majority. IMO Ozzie's OTT move is the result of an open clubface and encouraging him to try 1ps is completely the wrong advice.

[BrianW]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

The one plane swing relies more on the body rotation to square the face. The slicer (and most amatuers) needs to learn to square the face more with the hands because it just doesn't happen naturally for the majority. IMO Ozzie's OTT move is the result of an open clubface and encouraging him to try One Plane Swing is completely the wrong advice.

Please read my posts,

I have suggested fixes based on a one plane and two plane swing, the fixes are different and he can decide which are relevant.

I have not suggested he changes to a one plane swing, that was his proposal. My previous comments on the one plane swing were to explain it makes it harder to swing OTT and in response to your statements.

[kbp]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

Jbrunk is correct that "one plane" is a misnomer. There are flatter swings and more upright swings, but done correctly, neither operates on a single plane. I believe even Hogan illustrated two pieces of glass, set on different angles.


IMO, a flatter swing doesn’t make it harder to swing OTT. OTT is primarily due to the shoulders getting ahead of the mid and lower body, either from the beginning of the downswing or somewhere before impact. A change in spine angle is frequently the RESULT of the OTT move, rather than the cause. Of course when preformed properly, with a proper spine angle, both the flatter and the more upright swings do not go OTT.

Consider also the old "loop" drill. Basically, the instructor would have you take it back way outside and very upright and then "loop" it to the inside, down through the ball, ala Jim Furyk. This extreme upright swing with a large plane shift was used to discourages OTT (there’s actually more to it's effect than just a plane shift). Also, consider the common error of flat swinger in taking it back TOO flat or too inside and being forced to come back up, out, and OTT.

IMO, neither flatter or more upright favors OTT more than the other as an absolute rule. There are too many variables. Whether flatter or more upright is a "better" choice, I think depends on the person and their tendencies.

[BrianW]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

I just give up on this one.

I have explained clearly that a one (rotary/on) plane swing has a swing path that goes back on the shoulder plane and returns to the address plane. It seems that some people here wish to misinterpret that into something else for some reason and keep referring to planes rather than path. If they think that the concept is flawed then they must have a more advanced concept than me, Chuck Quinton, Jim Hardy and Moe Norman come to that.

If you wish to call a 'one plane' a 'flatter' and a 'two plane' an 'upright' then feel free, personally I cannot be bothered with that kind of detail and have been around to long to get involved with this type of hidden agenda debate. I say again before leaving: My advice was to offer a solution based on two differing swing types that was genuinely meant to assist the OP.

[jbrunk]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

I just give up on this one.

I have explained clearly that a one (rotary/on) plane swing has a swing path that goes back on the shoulder plane and returns to the address plane. It seems that some people here wish to misinterpret that into something else for some reason and keep referring to planes rather than path. If they think that the concept is flawed then they must have a more advanced concept than me, Chuck Quinton, Jim Hardy and Moe Norman come to that.

If you wish to call a 'one plane' a 'flatter' and a 'two plane' an 'upright' then feel free, personally I cannot be bothered with that kind of detail and have been around to long to get involved with this type of hidden agenda debate. I say again before leaving: My advice was to offer a solution based on two differing swing types that was genuinely meant to assist the OP.

I do not wish to quarrel Brian, and I know that you know a lot of good things (I have posted on as much before) about the swing. This particular area is just one where you and I will always disagree.

[jbrunk]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

My main point for you Ozzie, is that you need to fix the clubface. You are a 26 handicapper, which probably means you slice. You slice because the clubface is too open and too combat this you come OTT and swing way left. No swing 'theory' is going to fix this for you, just some good old clubface rotation. Trust me when I say the world will open up to you once you learn to properly square the face through impact.

Got any video of your swing?

[kbp]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

And my reason for making the distinction is not to get under Brain’s apparently sensitive.skin, but to reinforce to the OP that since swings do not operate on "one plane", the so-called "one plane" swing is not a magic bullet against OTT. It also requires a plane shift in the downswing. The choice of a particular plane/path/whatever over another is not the problem. The problem is improper sequencing, weight distribution, and use of the wrong muscles.

IMO, most of the problem with golf instruction for beginners is that instructors won’t bother themselves with the details. Over simplification leads to misconceptions and to improper action . I’ve heard the golf swing described to beginners as a "turn back and a turn through", but when implemented under those simple instructions, 99 percent of beginners jut out to the ball and go OTT as soon as they are on their own.

[BrianW]

Re: Should I try the one-plane-swing?

And my reason for making the distinction is not to get under Brain’s apparently sensitive.skin, but to reinforce to the OP that since swings do not operate on "one plane", the so-called "one plane" swing is not a magic bullet against OTT. It also requires a plane shift in the downswing. The choice of a particular plane/path/whatever over another is not the problem. The problem is improper sequencing, weight distribution, and use of the wrong muscles.

IMO, most of the problem with golf instruction for beginners is that instructors won’t bother themselves with the details. Over simplification leads to misconceptions and to improper action . I’ve heard the golf swing described to beginners as a "turn back and a turn through", but when implemented under those simple instructions, 99 percent of beginners jut out to the ball and go OTT as soon as they are on their own.

Spot on, I am quite sensitive to nit pickers actually.