flipping hands @ impact

[BrianW]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

OK Guys, lets get back to the subject please.

Seems to me there are a number of reasons that people flip their hands at the ball, I think the prime reason is the way our brains think that to get the ball up you need to get the club head under it and scoop it up. It takes some determined effort to feel confident in hitting down to get the ball up.

[rogue]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

yup, agreed with that. mental concepts often dictate most of our technique.
Personally i learned to hit down on the ball through a mixture of nail analogy, and by trying punch shots into the 50 yard sign as a junior

[kbp]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

> Those that are the biggest blowhards are the fastest back pedalers.

> They have neither the courage of their convictions nor the grace to acknowledge a mistake with an apology.

> Funny how that works.

> This is not pointed at anyone in particular.



> Flipping the hands is a b**** to fix.

[kbp]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

Sorry, Brian and others. I was cross posting with Brian’s last post.

For beginners and the uninformed, flipping is frequently as Brian has stated, trying to lift the ball. In the more advanced or more knowledgeable player, those who "know better", the flip can be a compensation for the body "blocking" the hands from getting ahead of the ball. It can also be a compensation for an open clubface or from an inappropriate grip. Sometimes a combination of factors.

In these cases, to fix the flip you must determine the underlying cause and fix that first.

[BrianW]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

Sorry, Brian and others. I was cross posting with Brian’s last post.

For beginners and the uninformed, flipping is frequently as Brian has stated, trying to lift the ball. In the more advanced or more knowledgeable player, those who "know better", the flip can be a compensation for the body "blocking" the hands from getting ahead of the ball. It can also be a compensation for an open clubface or from an inappropriate grip. Sometimes a combination of factors.

In these cases, to fix the flip you must determine the underlying cause and fix that first.

Spot on analysis

[keiko]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

The primary reason people flip is they don't hinge the wrists and finish the backswing.

Spot on analysis

[BrianW]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

I think we can all agree there can be many reasons for it and as suggested, the solution is to address the cause not only the symptom.

[rogue]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

The primary reason people flip is they don't hinge the wrists and finish the backswing.

Keiko, it is not always a technical reason. and if they dont do the above, you have to ask why they dont do that to get to a root cause - maybe their wrist joint is made up differently or they have arthritis and cannot hinge 'correctly'. Im sure these players can still maintain (what little) lag/forward shaft lean at impact.

Re finishing the backswing. What does this mean exactly - what is a finished backswing?

heres a question for you Keiko, many touring professionals (and amateurs) when PITCHING use a small swing and very little (if any) hinging of the wrists, yet they still dont flip at it. why are they not flipping it if technically they are not hingeing or completing their swing? in fact one of the surest ways to stop flipping for a tour pro is to make a 3/4 (hence unfinished) swing and punch the ball towards the target.

the solution is to address the cause not only the symptom.

Brian - Although I can agree that finding the root cause is necessary, this is often unreasonably difficult as the root cause theoretically is always going to be influence by our beliefs.

• A teaching pro will be able to find a technical root cause
• A psychologist will be able to find a psychological root cause
• a fitness trainer will be able to find a strength/flexibility root cause
• a biomechanist will be able to fins a physiological root cause

the list goes on. and every one of the above will be able to give a theoretically sound explanation for why THEIR answer is 'THE' answer. then they will set up an impossible ideal to try and reach to improve.

Personally i like to do a bit of both (root and symptom) but often we cannot fully know the cause. But working on the symptom often (if done right) will have a knock on effect to the cause too - even if we dont know it.

[keiko]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

You must be joking. I won't dignify your post with anything now or in the future.

Keiko, it is not always a technical reason. and if they dont do the above, you have to ask why they dont do that to get to a root cause - maybe their wrist joint is made up differently or they have arthritis and cannot hinge 'correctly'. Im sure these players can still maintain (what little) lag/forward shaft lean at impact.

Re finishing the backswing. What does this mean exactly - what is a finished backswing?

heres a question for you Keiko, many touring professionals (and amateurs) when PITCHING use a small swing and very little (if any) hinging of the wrists, yet they still dont flip at it. why are they not finishing it if technically they are not hingeing or completing their swing?




Although I can agree that finding the root cause is necessary, this is often unreasonably difficult as the root cause theoretically is always going to be influence by our beliefs.

• A teaching pro will be able to find a technical root cause
• A psychologist will be able to find a psychological root cause
• a fitness trainer will be able to find a strength/flexibility root cause
• a biomechanist will be able to fins a physiological root cause

the list goes on. and every one of the above will be able to give a theoretically sound explanation for why THEIR answer is 'THE' answer. then they will set up an impossible ideal to try and reach to improve.

[rotator]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

> Those that are the biggest blowhards are the fastest back pedalers.

> They have neither the courage of their convictions nor the grace to acknowledge a mistake with an apology.

> Funny how that works.

> This is not pointed at anyone in particular.



> Flipping the hands is a b**** to fix.

Oh, good, bullet points.

[kbp]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

> Nine times out of ten it IS an obvious mechanical issue.

> I do not understand the basis for the wrist hinge/finished backswing comment either.

> Since the original comment is a couple of simple cliches, it’s hard to decipher it’s intent in this context.

> An intelligent, articulate explanation of the original comment would be nice, but is likely not possible.

> Hopefully I can join you on the list of people who will not be dignified with a response now or in the future.

[ubizmo]

Re: flipping hands @ impact

Reviving this thread...because I'm one of those duffers who has this problem. I know what the problem is, and what I'm supposed to be doing to fix it, but making it happen is a very variable thing.

Nobody has mentioned (I think) another cause of flipping, which is shifting weight to the back foot and getting stuck there. It's hard enough keeping the hands ahead of the club head when you're actually over the ball at impact; it's just about impossible when you're behind it.

The day after a particular bad day of golf, I can feel the muscle strain along the inside of my right forearm.

The address position unfortunately presets the brain to return to a vertical shaft position at impact. A forward press helps to break this, but I find it's even more helpful to rehearse the actual impact position in my pre-shot routine: the shaft tilted forward, hips opening, club head nailing down.

Greg Willis's right-hand drill is all about this problem, which he calls "swatting." Swatting is what you're doing when you flip the wrists through impact. The drill is simple, and it's one of the most constructive things you can do at a practice range. You hit a few dozen balls with a half swing, feeling solid impact, seeing the straight and low trajectory. Gradually you increase the swing, keeping the same feel.

For me, the feel of it is that I'm pushing the heel of my right palm through the impact zone, but pulling the club down onto the ball. When I have the mental focus to keep this feeling, I get great impact.

Ubizmo