epiphiany????

[30yearlayoff]

Ok, I think I am on to something....The difference between hitting and swinging.

Let's see if I can describe this feeling.... On the back swing, I used to feel very awkward. Very tight, limited Today, I was screwing around and did a faster takeaway and club up at half way back. Instead of forcing a further twist, I let the momentum of the swing speed carry my arms back as though they were floating. At the very end, I got this automatic wrist c ock.

From the top, everything fell into place. The first move down was both a shift of weight to left side and letting gravity pull the arms down to where the body took over and pulled the club through and I hit the most beautiful, straight, high but penetrating 7iron shot I ever hit.

I don't know if I am describing this feeling in a manner others can related to. It was so tension free and the shoulder turn was actually so much further back than normal. When I try to get the left shoulder back that far, I can't do it. It is fulll of tension.

Can anyone relate to what I am trying to describe here. It is such a free and easy, yet powerful swing compared to my old, stiff, quick, hitting style of before. After swinging with this feeling, my shots were longer and the dispersion was much tighter. Accuracy was mucho impressive.

[pnearn]

Re: epiphiany????

Youve found effortless power, the feeling where you hardly feel like you are swinging at all and letting gravity and the centrigrugal force created by your 'core' turning passive arms and hands. If like me you were an early hitter this is indeed golfing nirvana

The reason (the science bit!) is explained in the swing speed thread

Great work!!!

[doogkie]

Re: epiphiany????

i get that feeling when im practicing but playing its stiff....gotta work on bringing it to the course

[pnearn]

Re: epiphiany????

Let's see if I can describe this feeling.... On the back swing, I used to feel very awkward. Very tight, limited Today, I was screwing around and did a faster takeaway and club up at half way back. Instead of forcing a further twist, I let the momentum of the swing speed carry my arms back as though they were floating. At the very end, I got this automatic wrist c ock.

I showed this to my pro today and he said you are definitely on the right track esp with the quicker backswing. He said far too many people try and push or lift the club club, rather than 'swing' it. He had me do a drill wherby if you take a club (or even your right arm) and use you shoulders to swing your wrists to about half way back 2 things will happen. One, your wrists will set much earlier (so they are fully set by halfway back, this is the premise behind that leadbetter swingsetter device) and two, the momentum of your back swing will in effect cause you to 'bounce' back from your coiled right side. This is the transition. On the opposite side, try a really slow backswing with no momentum, when you reach the top your body stops moving and you have to initiate the lower body movement back yourself, which, as he says, causes so many problems. Try it, it works

He also pointed out how many pro's you see take the club back slowly, none of them do. Its a swing back which builds momentum

His view clearly, but an interesting one and it certainly works for me

[nickwbryant]

Re: epiphiany????

pnearn - can you explain what you mean by "use you shoulders to swing your wrists to about half way back" please - sounds interesting

cheers
nick

[pnearn]

Re: epiphiany????

pnearn - can you explain what you mean by "use you shoulders to swing your wrists to about half way back" please - sounds interesting

cheers
nick

What I mean is just turn your shoulders/torso and keep your hands and arms loose and relaxed. They should feel almost like they get flung upwards. As 30yearlayoff stated, once the wrists are set and the hands above your waist the arms keep going up with momentum

It will feel like a much more compact and narrow swing if youve been trying something like low and slow but what you are doing is maintaining connection between your arms and your body and setting the club on plane early

[30yearlayoff]

Re: epiphiany????

Yep....my problem was the move down. In video, I could see it. It was terrible

The new backswing is more of a floating sensation from half way back to the top...and then a smiilar but different sensation from top to half way down. The speed is mostly built from half down to halfway after impact.

The key is to quickly but smoothly go from takeaway to half up and feel the wrist set. From that point, it is a floating feeling as the left shoulder comes back past the ball. then, instead of a pause, there is a natural feeling of the wrists doing something....like c ocking even more. As they naturally un-c ock (or rebound)...everything unwinds into the downswing.

Does this make sense. It's too new to take the feel and describe it.

Once I got into a groove of this swing, I hit about 50 balls. I would hit one bad shot for every 4-5 good ones...really good ones. That is an accomplishment for me.

Also, I got the PW out and hit some 30-100 yd pitches. Even those were much better even though I didn't take the PW back to full swing. I took it back quicker and tried to feel the floating up sensation...even if it was 1/2 swing...before I started down.

Can't wait to get to the range today!!!

[30yearlayoff]

Re: epiphiany????

I've heard about the tempo and quicker back swing and tried it many times. It only made things worse because of TENSION. Now, I finally understand what tension does to rob you of power...from start to finish. If you have too tight of a grip, too much tension in forearms, chest, shoulders, arms against chest, back, etc...... you can't achieve this feeling.

Iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiah, Iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiia, Iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiah, I'm hooked on a feeling.....(singing here....I know...the answer is I used the $ for singing lessons to 'ho golf clubs).

I think what turned me on to this feeling was something I read about what an ol' timer (Sam Snead) said to someone he was playing with. The guy was chopin' (hackin') away and Snead said he was all tensed up like he was beating something up. He said the golf swing is like a waltz. After looking at my swing, I looked the same way. So, I just let go and tried to flow and eureka....I found the dance.

One thing that I did see pop up that needs work. You can get a little too waltzie and hit a real clunker. You must still build that power from half to half.

I showed this to my pro today and he said you are definitely on the right track esp with the quicker backswing. He said far too many people try and push or lift the club club, rather than 'swing' it. He had me do a drill wherby if you take a club (or even your right arm) and use you shoulders to swing your wrists to about half way back 2 things will happen. One, your wrists will set much earlier (so they are fully set by halfway back, this is the premise behind that leadbetter swingsetter device) and two, the momentum of your back swing will in effect cause you to 'bounce' back from your coiled right side. This is the transition. On the opposite side, try a really slow backswing with no momentum, when you reach the top your body stops moving and you have to initiate the lower body movement back yourself, which, as he says, causes so many problems. Try it, it works

He also pointed out how many pro's you see take the club back slowly, none of them do. Its a swing back which builds momentum

His view clearly, but an interesting one and it certainly works for me

[pnearn]

Re: epiphiany????

Yes, tension is the enemy, specifically upper body tension. Coincidentally what i was working on with the pro today was keeping my left knee more stable in the backswing, feeling like I maintained the gap between my knees at the top and being more centered over the ball. This had the effect of making me think only about tension in my lower body to give me a stable base from which I can then swing back and through with a very loose and syrupy feeling upper body

[30yearlayoff]

Re: epiphiany????

Yep....loose and syrupy....seems good!!!

Yes, tension is the enemy, specifically upper body tension. Coincidentally what i was working on with the pro today was keeping my left knee more stable in the backswing, feeling like I maintained the gap between my knees at the top and being more centered over the ball. This had the effect of making me think only about tension in my lower body to give me a stable base from which I can then swing back and through with a very loose and syrupy feeling upper body

[ubizmo]

Re: epiphiany????

It's interesting, because the "received wisdom" is that the backswing should be slow, and most people rush it. Of course, the word "slow" is imprecise. On the one hand, the faster the backswing, the more energy required to brake and reverse direction--wasted energy. On the other hand, if there is no conscious braking and it's done by the coiling of the body, then a faster backswing puts more energy into the coiling, and therefore more in the uncoiling.

I have sometimes felt that a slower backswing only succeeds in giving me more time to move my body into a funny position, but I really don't know for sure. I've found that I'm better off thinking about the *shape* of the backswing, and keeping it wide and extended, and letting the tempo take care of itself.

But who knows what I'll try next week?

[pnearn]

Re: epiphiany????

On the one hand, the faster the backswing, the more energy required to brake and reverse direction--wasted energy.

Not sure I agree completely. If you swing back into a coiled right side/flexed right knee with momentum, you should in effect 'spring' back towards the ball as your coil is maximised and you lower body cant support it any more. This is the transition and why (IMHO) it seems so natural to the pro's

Of course I could be totally wrong here but when I was drilling this with the pro this morning I could feel what he meant

[30yearlayoff]

Re: epiphany????

I think what Ubiz is saying is that when people swing quickly back, it is usually with a lot of tension. Thus, things are quick and rushed with poor results. This tension makes it difficult to coil fully and leave you in a good position for the down stroke. The key is fast with no tension and full extension and turn....in a waltz like manner. That is where the floating feeling comes in for me.

It is aboout 1pm and I am dying to get back out to the range...especially with my full set of irons. I'll report back after day 2 of EPIPHANY!!!

[30yearlayoff]

Re: epiphiany????

I just got up from my desk to swing a few....to feel my lower body. Consequently, the new swing took away feeling/attention to what the lower body was doing. It all syncs together

Yes, tension is the enemy, specifically upper body tension. Coincidentally what i was working on with the pro today was keeping my left knee more stable in the backswing, feeling like I maintained the gap between my knees at the top and being more centered over the ball. This had the effect of making me think only about tension in my lower body to give me a stable base from which I can then swing back and through with a very loose and syrupy feeling upper body

[30yearlayoff]

Re: epiphany????

Well, got to the range tonight. Started off pulling like crazy. Long and left. Hmmmm, what the heck is wrong???? Kept working on it and after about 200 balls, the feeling came back. Lucky I have a range pass and live only 1 minute from the course.

This thing is like a rhythm. Once I'm in it, I am good. I just need to hit that range every day for the next few days until it is 2nd nature.

Tonight, the backswing started quick trying to get the swing back going and the wrists were tight. Was building power too early. Hitting vs. swinging but thought I was swinging. It was the PW that got me the feeling back. Gotta pull that club around with the body. Just couldn't get it started with the 5 or 7.

I did learn that the focus is the snap that starts the momentum from takeaway to halfway back is a major key. If you've ever used the swing setter, that's the feeling. Take it away too quick and the swing gets rushed and you end up hitting. Take it back a bit easy and then snap back to the halfway up and then coast of to the top is the ticket.

Still very excited and feel like I'm turning a corner. Can't wait to play this weekend.