Please check my swing plane

[msklar92]

Re: Please check my swing plane

simon again,

from the videos i see 3 problems probably all related which lead to a very flat plane swing.

1) you are too upright at address
2) you are actually reaching for the ball with the ball lined up with the hosel
3) as a result of 1 and 2 you are swing back way inside the plane and turining over your left wrist without much rotation of the body

suggestions to get you more on plane

1_ more spine tilt at address with butt out as previous suggested
2- bring your ams in so they are connected to your body and will be hanging straight down
3 - the club may appear as if it is more lined up with the toe of the club face
4) now completely relax your arms and turn back and through. with the face of the club you should be able to extend through the ball more easily.

see if the pros agree.

[Simon Woo]

Re: Please check my swing plane

Hmm I'm not sure if that's because the above videos were with the 4 wood. Here's the one with the 7-iron. Does address look ok?

http://www.eys.com.sg/simon/simon%20...60324%2001.mpg

Funny thing, my coach was the one who actually said I was bringing the club out during the takeaway, so I was working hard to takea way more inside. Could it be a camera angle issue or could I have overdone the inside-takeaway in the video?

Coach also mentioned I was too wristy. Wonder if I might really need to get one of those wrist guides to sort this out. I'm ok if I keep it as my foremost (and perhaps only) swing thought, but once I don't think of it the wrist just goes back to that old habit. I guess this is what people mean you need a lot of practice to commit it to muscle memory?

Yep I realised in these shots I were not getting the wide arc and feeling the coil at the top. Gosh, 1001 things to remember altogether! (pnearn both links are the same?)

[GoNavy]

Re: Please check my swing plane

Simon don't feel bad, you suffer from the same thing ALL new golfer suffer from, early release and a slaping action with the hands. My advise, try making a swings without a ball using your left hand only, this will force your body to get a little more involved, you will load up at the top, your left wrist will naturaly flaten out, and since your new to golf and have weak golfing muscles, you will start down with the left side, because your too weak to do anything else. This will also stop the chicken wing thing you have going on after impact. Then transfer that feeling with the right hand on, try not to let it take over. You do need to bend over a little more, think of your shoulder and knees over your feet, head beyond toe line, butt beyond heel line.

[Simon Woo]

Re: Please check my swing plane

Thanks GoNavy. Oops I guess you were referring to the jerky motion I had at impact with my 7iron video? It did look at bit extreme when I reviewed the video, didn't realise I was doing something like that.

I think I developed this to get more oomph at impact, which I must say has worked out pretty well for me. Was struggling at about 100-110yds with my 7i until the past 3 weeks, and I am now getting 130-140yds consistently. I'm an Asian male standing at 5"5', and my coach said that that is quite a reasonable distance to expect. So by further working on my swing with the 7i, I should be looking at more distance and/or consistency?

Appreciate your comments, the drill with only the left hand is not new to me but I guess I never really took it seriously. But you are right, definitely a flat wrist at the top this way! (And I realised more width going back too). It kinda forces me to use the shoulder and chest to turn first or rather together with the arms during the takeaway. I must say it's definitely a very differently feeling than my swing now, where I realised the right hand does help a lot in bringing it back on the takeaway. In reality, could I actually swing using my right hand as just a support and taking all control out of it?

[pnearn]

Re: Please check my swing plane

Simon

Out of interest, how many practice sessions do you have a week, how many balls do you hit at each one and do you have a routine?

I totally changed the way I approached my range sessions a year ago and its dramatically improved my game. Let me know if youre interested and i'll note down what I now do (it will probably be long!)

[Simon Woo]

Re: Please check my swing plane

Hi pnearn,

Lately I only hit about 120-150 balls each session at the range, about twice a week. I usually start off with the 7i, then move on to the 5i, then hybrid, 4W and end off with some PW and SW shots. When I work on the swing, it's mainly with the 7i. I'm actually pretty happy with my 7i distance and direction, but as can be seen, the swing is not exactly technically 'perfect'. I just want to learn to swing well, although I'm not sure if I will necessary see further improvements with my 7i (in terms of consistency and/or distance?). And I guess the problem is the shots do not increase accordingly as I progress with the clubs.

I'm actually gunning for my PC (Proficiency Certificiate - some of you might know it's a requirement to have that in order to play in the courses here in Singapore) next month, so my coach has been making me swing with the driver this week. According to her (yes it's a lady heh), since I am already getting some launch and distance with my 4W, I should actually start practising with the driver.

So, in addition to working on the technical aspects of my swing with the 7i, I also go through the spectrum of clubs during my regular session at the range.

[RacLt7]

Re: Please check my swing plane

A few things i noticed...

Too upright at address. You need too follow through more (it appears as though once you hit the ball, you stop swinging) try hitting down on the ball, too fix this move your hands forward at address itll take a while to get used too. Also your swing seems too be all arm movent, rotate through your shot.

[pnearn]

Re: Please check my swing plane

Simon

I used to go the range and beat balls until about a year ago when a pro gave me some good advice which has helped my game immeasurably

When I go the range I will practice individual parts of the swing only for at least 10-20 minutes before I hit balls. To do this I lay one club pointing away from the target across the toes of my right foot and one towards the target across my left toes

I will then go through each of these motions

-Takeway. Feeling a low and slow one piece takeway until my arms are on top of the club across my toes and the clubhead is pointing to the sky. Here im looking to feel a really wide arc whilst not swaying and I like to feel everything moving together and my triangle staying intact. I may do some of these with my eyes closed to get the feeling

-Pivot. Here I go from the takeway to the top. I like to feel this more as a continuation of the takeaway turn but with more of a verctical lift. Im looking to get my hands high but keep them as far from my head as I can. I dont want to get parallel, just slightly laid off at the top. I also want to get my left shoulder acorss my right instep again without a sway. I do some of these with my eyes closed 'feeling' the flex maintained in my right knee. This seems to be your main problem area so this may be one to keep practicing the right feelings for

-Transition. Here im getting the club halfway down until is back parallel to the club on the ground again. You need to do thsi yourself and find your 'feel' for this move. It might be a hip bump or a left knee move, i like to pull down with my upper arms. If youre outside the line of the club, your coming over the top, inside youre in to out

-Impact. Gregs impact drill

-Half way through. The arms are in the opposite place to the takeway, parallel to the club on the left side with arms and clubhead extended down the line

-Finish, feel the left arm come up and arobnd as the shoulders keep turning. Finish up on your right foot in perfect balance

Once Ive worked on 'feeling' all these moves I then start slowly blending them together. Backswing, then downswing, then finish and then slowly build up full swings

Only when I feel im really happy will i then start to hit a PW or 9i. If im hitting straight i'll then work on tempo before moving through some other clubs. If im pulling or pushing i'll go back through the whole sequence again looking for why (i.e. I know a pull is over the top or closed shoulders so i'll check both)

May be worth trying. This has really helped me 'feel' what I need to do to make a good swing. Its only by your body and mind feeling what needs to happen to get in the right positions that you can learn. Having someone tell you to turn your hips on the transition is useless IMO unless you have ever felt how to do it properly and effectively

HTH

[hogans five lessons]

Re: Please check my swing plane

Uh oh Mr. Woo......

Please review Ben Hogan's Five Lessons The Modern Fundamentals of Golf to get a mental picture of swing plane.............

[Simon Woo]

Re: Please check my swing plane

Thanks RacLt7. I kinda have a good idea on the few things I need to fix (thanks for all the valuable comments from everyone) - now the problem is how to fix them :P I just can't seem to involve the body more in the swing, the athletic movements that I see so clearly lacking in my swing. It's always just arms and hands

[msklar92]

Re: Please check my swing plane

simon,

one thing you might try is a weighted club, or add those donut weights to one of your clubs. Take some practice swings just feeling the weight of the club head. Make them smooth, big shoulder turn back and through. Once you have the feel of this, try and make the same swing with the ball. Do not try to hit the ball, let the ball get in the way of the club head. this might help you to focus on swinging the club, rather than get too caught up in the mechanics. will also help strengthen golf muscles.

[Simon Woo]

Re: Please check my swing plane

Just to confirm, a weight club means there is a lot of weight at the head, and not that the club is just made to be heavier, right? I think I am more of a hitter than a swinger, and from a few resources that I have come across, that seems to be equally acceptable as well? One book I am reading now is called the The Golf Instruction Manual by Steven Newell. I believe it should be quite popular as I actually realised that a lot of posts in this board were referring to material found in that book? :P

[msklar92]

Re: Please check my swing plane

either one is fine. the donuts are cheaper than the clubs. other people at this site have suggessted putting sand in the shaft. anything to get you swinging and stop thinking.

[Simon Woo]

Re: Please check my swing plane

Thanks msklar, I've been trying to swing without thinking about the hands. It feels good if I just take a club and swing, but once I put a ball there, I am virtually unable to do the same swing because I always end up trying to 'hit' the ball with the clubhead. Without the ball I don't care about swing path, wrist hinge, creating lag, impact etc. With a ball there, seriously, do the good players actually also not think about those things? If you look at it, any one of those 4 items I listed would intuitively be hand-dominated, no?

I'm currently reading the 8 Step Swing by Jim McLean. It seems like for juniors/ladies/beginners, hitting is a more common way to golf, but as you get into the intermediate stage, you learn to take the arms/hands out of the swing. I wonder if all you good players also go through that stage before you really learnt how to swing without the arms/hands?

[pnearn]

Re: Please check my swing plane

Simon

Youve reached the point now where you are at a mental barrier. Welcome to golf! .. seriously IMHO no good players think about the hands much in the swing unless you delibrately want to turn the club over or hold it off. Power comes from the big muscles in the swing such as your back and shoulders not the smaller ones (i.e. your hands). You really have to imagine they and your forearms are just an extension of the handle and that is your shoulders swinging the club

I spent a good while having to learn and trust my swinging motion to strike the ball and not hitting it with the hands. What worked for me was learning just to turn the upper body back and through and keeping a really light grip. You cant use your hands with a really light grip

One other thing Simon, and with all due respect, I think that maybe reading too many books now isnt helping you. Its just too much information to take in. Ten books, ten different sets of advice. Looking at your swing videos you are pretty close to having a good swing. You just need to go work on a few things, learn how YOU feel the correct motions, keep checking yourself on video and brak a few mental barriers (swing dont hit). I used to swallow golf books 3 or 4 years ago but I think it started doing more harm than good since you start trying to add new motions into a swing you are halfway throuugh grooving and tinkering with. Plus it messes with your head! Its info overload!