Feedback on my swing.

[Samson72]

Hello everybody! this is my first post
I've been playing golf for about 18 months and would like to get some feedback on my swing.

http://www.favoritlanken.se/0701f.avi

/Samson

[GregJWillis]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

16 Megs? That file has to be cut down if you want others to watch it.

[Robert O' Keeffe]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

Hey Samson,

I dont see much wrong. Great setup, solid left side, great rhythm, great strike. What more do you want? Well done

[msklar92]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

If you stop your swing at near the point of impact, you will see you left arm coming off your body - almost a slight chickenwing. It should be connected to your torso and fold up on the through swing. Otherwise good swing.

[Jeff Mann]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

I really need to see your down-the-line video to fully criticise your swing.

However, based on your face-on video, I think that your major fault is the fact that you start the downswing from the top-down with a shoulder rotation, instead of starting from the bottom-up with a hip shift-rotation.

See - http://jeffmann.net/Samson72.jpg

Note that your shoulders have rotated as much as your hips and are already square to the target. The shoulders should be far behind the hips in the early downswing.

Note that your right elbow is still far from your right hip area. The right elbow should lead the right side in the downswing and should already be jammed in your right hips area when your hands reach waist level.

Note that you have lost your wrist lag angle due to casting. That fits in with the fact that you start the downswing with a shoulder turn instead of a lower body rotation. You probably pull down on the club with your hands instead of having passive hands.

See my downswing review at http://jeffmann.net/downswing.htm

In particular, look at Ben Hogan when his hands are at waist level.

See - http://jeffmann.net/Hogan-DScomposite.jpg

Note that he still has tremendous wrist lag and the clubshaft is still far behind him. Note that his right elbow is close to his right hip. Note that his right shoulder is still well back. All those features are due to the fact that he starts the downswing with an aggressive hip shift rotation.

You need to start your downswing with a lower body move.

I need a down-the-line view to critique your backswing.

Jeff.

p.s. You definitely chicken-wing in your early followthrough.

[Jeff Mann]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

A few more points - note how Ben Hogan's right elbow is below his left arm. That indicates that his right elbow is leading the right shoulder/hands in the downswing (due to starting the downswing with a hip shift-rotation). Your right elbow is floating above your left arm.

Also note that your left arm is slightly bent at the elbow - probably because you are pushing with your right side (right shoulder rotation) rather than pulling with your left side (left shoulder rotation). If you start the downswing with a hip shift-rotation, correct sequencing will allow your left shoulder to move first (before your right shoulder) => then you will pull through the shot instead of push through the shot. Your left arm collapses and chicken-wings in the immediate post-impact phase because you are pushing with your right side, instead of pulling with your left side.

Jeff.

[Jeff Mann]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

One final image - see http://jeffmann.net/Samson72ChickenWing.jpg

Note how your left arm collapses and chicken-wings in the early post-impact phase of the followthrough.

I have compared your swing to Ernie Els at the same point in the followthrough. Note that Ernie's left arm is straight and fully extended.

Also, note that your hips are square to the target while Ernie's hips are well open (>45 degrees open). Note that Ernie's right foot is only contacting the ground at his right toe area, showing that he has fully weight-shifted to the left. Note that your right foot is still planted on the ground due to inadequate lower body rotation and inadequate lower body weight-transfer to the left. That's your major fault - not starting your downswing with a lower body shift-rotation with good weight transfer.

Jeff.

[Samson72]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

Hi Again!
I thank you all for your replies.
Jeff! Here you have a video clip from behind. I have also noticed my poor hip rotation. it is pretty obvious when you look at my right heel. It stays planted all the way untill my swing is at 3 a clock. Thanks again for taking time to review my swing, and I hope that you also find some good things in my swing I normaly have a better balance and a more even tempo but the clip was shot after 3 months of not touching the clubs so I felt a bit rusty.


http://www.favoritlanken.se/0701b.avi

/Samson

[Neil18]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

Samson,

For having only been playing for 18 months, and 3 of those you haven't touched a club, you should be very proud of yourself. You're doing so many things right. I don't think you have to do much more to improve the efficiency of your swing.

For the moment, three simple things I would say is all you need to look at:

1. (down the line) In your backswing, if you look at your head in relation to a mark on the wall, you can see movement forwards in your backswing. This causes a lot of what isn't quite right in your swing. A lot of people do it without realising too. Think of swinging around that which is established at address. Set up and get a friend to hold the butt end of a club just off your forehead. If you touch that in your backswing, you're leaning forward. Practice like this until you stop touching the butt of the club. When you get used to it you'll be swinging back around your posture in the backswing.

2. (face on). Move the ball a little forward in your stance. You sway a bit to get behind the ball. This leads to the third thing:

3. (face on + down the line). Again it's a weight thing, but also head position (I've put these together because you can work on it together). If you move the ball forward slightly as above you won't need to do as much in the backswing to get your head behind the ball. BUT, once you've got your head there, leave it there. At the moment, your upper body move at the ball from the top (as pointed out by Jeffman) puts your head straight back over the top of the ball. This is what leads to loss of lag. Additionally, you've got a bit of a Lee Westwood thing going on in that you dip toward impact, losing height = chicken wing so you don't chunk it.

In summary:

Keep your height, keep your head behind the ball position till it's gone. I don't think you've got a problem with weight shift. You clearly get onto your left side. You wouldn't get your head over the ball if you didn't. But once you get to keeping your head behind the ball in the downswing, you'll naturally learn to kick your right knee toward your left in the downswing. For your swing, that's what will get your weight on the left side and better hip rotation, but the head staying back. It's harder to keep your head behind the ball with a straight right leg. Do this and eventually your downswing will shallow out a bit and you'll be hitting it more crisp than you already do.

Hope this helps and is simple to follow.

[JohnP]

Re: Jeff Mann

Jeff - just wanted to say what great work you are doing around here, the pics you have put together to illustrate the (very) slight flaws in Samson72's swing are superb and they illustrate your points perfectly.

One day I will have the guts to put my own swing up here!

But in the meantime - keep up the great work!

[Jeff Mann]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

Samson72

I do have something good to say about your swing.

You have excellent posture and a good address position.

Your backswing is also good except for one major fault.

See - http://jeffmann.net/Samson2BS1.jpg

Note that you allow the right knee to straighten. That causes your pelvis to tilt up at the end of your backswing, and it also affects your ability to coil-up properly in the BS by allowing your right hip to over-rotate.

See my chapter on the backswing at http://jeffmann.net/backswing.htm

Compare yourself to Tiger Woods - note how he keeps his right knee flexed, and see how he limits hip rotation in the backswing. He limits his hip rotation to <30 degrees while your hips rotate >45 degrees.

Your biggest fault is your downswing.

See - http://jeffmann.net/Samson72DL.jpg

Note how you come over-the-top because you start the downswing with an upper body move (right shoulder rotation) that takes your hands quickly over your toe line, and your downswing is too steep. Note that your downswing is out-to-in because of your over-the-top move, and that your followthrough is consequently too inside and too around the body. Note how your clubshaft first appears below your left shoulder in the followthrough, which is too low.

Your downswing move is called an "upper body dive" which I describe in my downswing chapter at http://jeffmann.net/downswing.htm

Note how passive your hips are in the downswing - you are flat-footed in the late downswing and your shoulders are leading your passive hips during the downswing (instead of having active hips which start the downswing and lead the shoulders). Your downswing is entirely an upper body downswing, and you have a classic "upper body dive" type of downswing. You need to have an in-to-in clubhead swingpath (and not an out-to-in clubhead swingpath), and that can only be accomplished if your clubshaft approaches the ball along an inside track - which requires that the downswing start from the bottom-up (lower body first, shoulders second).

You have great athleticism and you could easily be a scratch golfer if you completely revise your downswing according to the principles I give in my downswing chapter. You ABSOLUTELY have to learn to first start the downswing with an active hip shift-rotation move. That should be the major emphasis of your golf practicing sessions. If you don't believe me, take my photos to a golf instructor and get an independent opinion.

Good luck!

Jeff.

[msklar92]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

One simple drill you can try is to put a headcover under your left arm. Practice swinging with just your left arm and let the left arm fold up keeping the connection to your chest. if the head cover falls down, you have lost the connection.

[Jeff Mann]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

Samson72

I have used your "upper body dive" downswing images in my revised downswing chapter - as an anonymous golfer (and completely obscured your face) - if you don't mind my using those images? They are a perfect example of an "upper body dive" movement for the downswing chapter of my free online review of the golf swing.

See - http://jeffmann.net/downswing.htm

Jeff.

[GoNavy]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

Samson72

I have used your "upper body dive" downswing images in my revised downswing chapter - as an anonymous golfer (and completely obscured your face) - if you don't mind my using those images? They are a perfect example of an "upper body dive" movement for the downswing chapter of my free online review of the golf swing.

See - http://jeffmann.net/downswing.htm

Jeff.

Jeff I am sure your online instruction is going to be accurate, but, I believe you are going to suffer the same killer problem all instruction book suffer from...it is too damm wordy, if thats a word. I read it awhile then just got bored couldn't finish it, it just says the same thing I have read a hundred times. It may indeed be different or even earth shatering, but myself or people like myself will never know, because we get bored reading and give up, or lose focus...may be a slight case of ADD..what ever, someone needs to get this down to quick explaination training that works.

If you notice most if not all of responses are very short, a paragraph or two at most, I tend to teach the same way, and have found it to be much more effective. I don't say much during a lesson, now when I do, the student tend to really listen, because he becomes starved for any feed back, what I say is usually short and to the point...lol...I teach the ADD way...I don't give them time for the mind to wonder away.

Sorry to hijack the thread, just had to get this out there. Not criticizing Jeff, just offering my opinion.

[Jeff Mann]

Re: Feedback on my swing.

I agree that I am too wordy. I think that only a small subset of beginner golfers will be willing to read my stuff.

I hope to complete my free, online review within a few weeks. It will be a free online review of the modern golf swing for beginner golfers (not for advanced golfers who already know this stuff). As you stated, many beginner golfers will find it too tedious to plough through my turgid prose, and lengthy explanations, but I hope that a few beginner golfers will find my free online review helpful.

At the very least, they may enjoy the great photos :-)

Jeff.