Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

[jakeclk]

I've been struggling a lot lately with a bad case of the sh##ks. I think it stems from my inherent OTT downswing. As usual, the sh##ks show up almost exclusively on the range, but rarely on the course.

Below is a link to several videos of my golf swing. I would greatly appreciate any tips or insights that you guys could give me.

YouTube - Shank FO

YouTube - Shank DTL

YouTube - Shank DTL

Thanks.

[AussieGolfBoy]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

looks like your standing too close to the ball..

i didn't pick anything up that u were doing wrong on teh first video in regards to bad action. but in teh 2nd and 3rd ones, looked like u were coming up on the ball too early, and looking up.

seamed you held the same swing path with the club, so maybe try and bring the club inside more and let your hand rotate through at impact a bit more. you could also be pushing it.

i'm not expert, but thats just my opinion.

[BrianW]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

I agree you look to close to the ball at address, it is lined up close to the clubs hozel. Try setting up with the ball nearer the toe.

You don't seem to be turning your hips enough in the downswing and finishing with your belt buckle towards the target, push through a bit more it may stop you pushing the ball right.

[takinitdeep]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

Lack of body movement on downswing and weight shift forward with right knee moving laterally toward left creates static body movement at impact which causes the s****s

I agree you look to close to the ball at address, it is lined up close to the clubs hozel. Try setting up with the ball nearer the toe.

You don't seem to be turning your hips enough in the downswing and finishing with your belt buckle towards the target, push through a bit more it may stop you pushing the ball right.

[jakeclk]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

Thanks for the replies so far.

I have tried standing further from the ball, but I still manage to shank it just the same. I can definitely see and feel that my lower body is not driving the down swing.

Using V1 software to slow down my swing, both DTL and FO, it looks like (1) I'm making a lousy shoulder turn on the BS - more of a reverse pivot; (2) the reverse pivot position at the top causes me to come OTT; (3) the lack of a correct shoulder turn prevents me from properly engaging the lower body on the DS (it's as if there is not enough tension between my upper body and lower body at the top to really fire my hips at the beginning of the DS; and (4) the lack of shoulder turn and lack of lower body action prevent me from routing the club on an inside path.

I guess I need to learn how to make a better shoulder turn on the back swing (and hopefully everything else will fall into place). Does anyone have any suggestions as to how I can overcome my tendency to do a reverse pivot? No matter how much I've read and try, i don't seem to be able to make a correct turn. Maybe I need a shrink!!

[BrianW]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

Thanks for the replies so far.

I have tried standing further from the ball, but I still manage to shank it just the same. I can definitely see and feel that my lower body is not driving the down swing.

Using V1 software to slow down my swing, both DTL and FO, it looks like (1) I'm making a lousy shoulder turn on the BS - more of a reverse pivot; (2) the reverse pivot position at the top causes me to come OTT; (3) the lack of a correct shoulder turn prevents me from properly engaging the lower body on the DS (it's as if there is not enough tension between my upper body and lower body at the top to really fire my hips at the beginning of the DS; and (4) the lack of shoulder turn and lack of lower body action prevent me from routing the club on an inside path.

I guess I need to learn how to make a better shoulder turn on the back swing (and hopefully everything else will fall into place). Does anyone have any suggestions as to how I can overcome my tendency to do a reverse pivot? No matter how much I've read and try, i don't seem to be able to make a correct turn. Maybe I need a shrink!!

OK lets See if we can get you to understand how it happens which should point out the cure at the same time.

As you turn back and through the swing imagine a point centre between your shoulders and a few inches below your neck as a pivot point. I know you also rotate through your spine but lets consider the lateral pivoting.

As you turn back this pivot will create a very small tilt forward with the head and upper torso but very little, it will pivot more lower weight back and onto the inside of the rear foot though. Now as you swing down using that same pivot point your head and upper torso will keep back behind the ball and your lower torso and hips will push forward from the pivot point while transferring the weight onto the front leg.

In a reverse pivot this pivot point is low down around your belt buckle position, on the backswing the opposite happens, your upper body is pivoted back with weight moving over the front foot, in the down swing you then pivot the weight onto the back foot creating the dreaded reverse "C"

Here is a picture I have used a few times to show how a correct pivot works, see the bottom image and how he is pivoting from that spot between the shoulders:

[jambalaya]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

Letting your shoulders be the driving force in starting your backswing and controlling your arms is one key to getting rid of that reverse pivot. When I first took lessons about four years ago the reverse pivot was a big problem for me. A key to getting rid of it I think is to initiate the back swing with a shoulder turn and think of keeping your hands centered on your torso. If your arms control your backswing and outrace the shoulders back they actually create a forward pressure on your shoulders I think. This is partially what I think creates a reverse pivot.

Stand erect and put your arms straight out in front of you with hands together. Put a club in your hands if you like and do the same. Now rotate back from your waist only keeping your hands straight out in front of you centered on your chest. Don't use your arms at all. Just go back and forth doing this move. That is how you rotate in the backswing but you are bent over in the address position in a regular back swing. Chances are your hand and therefore your arms move first in your backswing and drag your shoulders around. It is your arms putting pressure on your shoulders which help to create that reverse C position.

When you try to incorporate this thought into your swing you are going to think that your backswing is too short, restricted. You won't trust that you have enough backswing to hit the ball like you want. You may try to lift your arms more which will also create a reverse pivot if you lift them too much. But you have plenty of backswing. Especially if you learn to power your swing more with your hip and shoulder turn.

[jbrunk]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

I've been struggling a lot lately with a bad case of the sh##ks. I think it stems from my inherent OTT downswing. As usual, the sh##ks show up almost exclusively on the range, but rarely on the course.

Below is a link to several videos of my golf swing. I would greatly appreciate any tips or insights that you guys could give me.

YouTube - Shank FO

YouTube - Shank DTL

YouTube - Shank DTL

Thanks.

IMO, not much is going to change with that clubface as open as it is before impact.

[Robert O' Keeffe]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

Jake,

Here's what I see. Firstly you are taking it away outside the line. Secondly, you are not doing anything with your wrists until you are at the top. This is encoraging the club to come back down with the face open and hence the shank. Finally, try standing away from the ball a tad more, bend the knees, and try to find the feeling of sitting on a stool. Also, at adress, drop your right shoulder a little.

Robert

[golfndawg]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

I've been struggling a lot lately with a bad case of the sh##ks. I think it stems from my inherent OTT downswing. As usual, the sh##ks show up almost exclusively on the range, but rarely on the course.

Below is a link to several videos of my golf swing. I would greatly appreciate any tips or insights that you guys could give me.

YouTube - Shank FO

YouTube - Shank DTL

YouTube - Shank DTL

Thanks.

I don't believe you are maintaining your spine angle.......Especially the front on view...Spine angle is raising on the backswing.....BIG NO NO....Got the looks of 1 Planer and with some rotation should be a good thing.

One more thing.....from the front on you seem to be bumping the right hip up on the backswing which I believe is the reason for not maintaining your spine angle

[jdavidp]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

This is my first post so please don't give me a hard time !

Jakeclk,
Your swing reminds me very much of mine I took a while back, as I suffered from the shanks and OTT.

At the start of the DTL video, put your mouse pointer at the peak of your cap and notice how much your head has moved towards your toes when you reach the top of your backswing.
Your head (and body) moves at least 2".
This is caused by a poor shoulder turn and over-swinging.
This means on your downswing you have to re-route the club backs in towards your body to strike the ball in the middle of the clubface.
If you don't get it right - you hit the shank (if you do you hit a pull).
Standing further from the ball will make this worse - I know i've been there.
Jambalaya's advice on using the shoulders to drive the backswing is really good and helps with the reverse pivot.

There it is, i've done it - my first post - now let me have it!

[jbrunk]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

I've been struggling a lot lately with a bad case of the sh##ks. I think it stems from my inherent OTT downswing. As usual, the sh##ks show up almost exclusively on the range, but rarely on the course.

Below is a link to several videos of my golf swing. I would greatly appreciate any tips or insights that you guys could give me.

YouTube - Shank FO

YouTube - Shank DTL

YouTube - Shank DTL

Thanks.

Manzella Golf Forum#

[edshaw]

Re: Problem coming OTT and Sh**ks

Here's a link that someone posted on this
forum that might help. I know it was a
help to me.

YouTube - Gary Player Swing Analysis

Especially watch the part where Gary Player exaggerates
the effect of getting the hands above the club. Note in
your follow through the same effect is there. The arms and hands
should follow the swing plane right through, finishing high.