the "tray" position at the top...

[frubalu]

I don't know why, but I seem to be having an extremely difficult time at the top of my swing achieving the 'tray' position (I hope everyone knows what I mean by the tray position, that's just what my swing coach calls it). I 'cup' my wrist at the top, which directly causes the overswinging, or lagging or my club at the top. It is absolutely killing my distance and accuracy. Any drills or tips that could help me with this?

[Simon Woo]

Re: the "tray" position at the top...

Is your upper arm at an angle of 90% to your body? If by overswinging you mean that your club head droops too low at the top of your swing, check the angle of your upper arm and your body, and if you elbow is too far (chicken wing)?

[gord962]

Re: the "tray" position at the top...

Here are two drills to help:
http://members.shaw.ca/gord962/drills/top_position.htm to explain the top position and some check positions to help you out.
http://members.cox.net/gregjwillis/LESSON1.htm to explain how the right hand works in the golf swing.

[LowPost42]

Re: the "tray" position at the top...

The cupping of the trailing wrist shouldn't be the cause of overswinging. It's a source of tremendous power and accuracy, actually (Greg has a right hand drill that actually emphasizes this cupping).

Overswinging is usually done with an over-rotation of the shoulders that often lead to a reverse pivot, or a lead wrist breakdown that allows the club to flop.

[Simon Woo]

Re: the "tray" position at the top...

Does the cupped right hand apply just as much to using the woods and driver? I always feel that I am not swinging wide enough if I cup the right hand so much...

[Simon Woo]

Re: the "tray" position at the top...

I don't know why, but this is a major issue for me too. Everytime I cock my right wrist, my left wrist cups

[gord962]

Re: the "tray" position at the top...

I think you are mixing terminology up - cupped is if your wrist is bent backwards. If your right wrist is in the tray position at the top of your backswing, it is impossible to cup your left wrist, unless you have a baseball swing. If this is the case, your hands are too close to your head and your left arm is bent. At the top of your swing, your hands should be as far away from your head and your left arm should be relatively (or comfortably) straight (not locked at the elbow).

If your left wrist isn't flat, then there is a chance that your arms aren't in the correct position. Do the 90* check - upper arm (bicep/tricep) is 90* to your upper body, forearm is 90* to your upper arm and your right hand is 90* to your forearm.

[Simon Woo]

Re: the "tray" position at the top...

Hi gord I agree with you - if you cup the right wrist, the left goes flat, and vice versa. The problem comes when I try to cock the right wrist (from Greg's right hand drill, we are supposed to cock the right wrist on the backswing, right?). When I try to cock the right wrist, the left wrist invariably starts cupping. Now I am wondering if by trying to cock the right wrist, I am in effect un-cupping it as well, leading to the cupped left wrist.

By the way I just posted a video of my swing under swing instructions ("Need help with wrists"), I'm not sure if you have hit the nail on the head, that perhaps it's because my hands are too close to my head? Will certainly experiment a bit further on that - thanks!