Bounce on hard ground

[golfshooter]

Hi all. On my local course, I continually find myself stuck trying to chip from hard ground. If a large amount of bounce is required from the soft stuff in a bunker then I assume small amount would be required from the hard ground. When I can, I would use a 7 iron and attempt to chip and run (which is still difficult from the hard stuff ) but what if one has say...a bunker to clear and a short run to the hole. A condition where a flop shot would be needed. Do I still try it with a lob wedge, if so how do I swing? At the moment I use a sand wedge but my success rate is very low, I either bounce the club and top it,dig the club in and barely make contact, or hit it thin burying it in the bunker or sending it flying to the other side of the green. Help!

Frustrated Regards, Peter.

[GolfJunkieSr]

Re: Bounce on hard ground

Hard ground means a club with less bounce should be used. It also helps to move the ball back in your stance a little more than normal. Next thing is to make sure your hands stay a head of the club face through impact. Keeping the hands a head of the club face reduces what ever bounce the club has, that you need to use for the required shot. Next don't ground your club in back of the ball. Hovering the club just a little off the ground at address will give you a better chance of picking the ball clean off the hard stuff. Keep your normal posture, but grip the club a little lower on the grip to allow the club head to hover off the ground. Finally get yourself a piece 1X10 and practice hitting this shot off of it. Make sure your weight shift forward is consistent to give yourself a consistent low point in your swing. Hope this helps. I know it works for me. GJS

[BrianW]

Re: Bounce on hard ground

I would not attempt a high lob shot off a hardpan lie, I would play a chip type shot with my 60 deg wedge and not expect to stop the ball up dead by the pin.

Here a video showing how to play an iron shot off hardpan lies:

[golfshooter]

Re: Bounce on hard ground

Hi guys, Thanks for the tips. I'll put them to good use. There is perhaps another solution to clearing the bunker. I have a 60 degree wedge called the "solution" made by dunlop,it has a sharpish edge and a large sole,forming a kind of mouth at the back. I hope that is clear enough. Technically except for the edge it could be said to have a huge bounce. I have been practicing with it at home on hard ground and because of the edge it seems easy to make clean contact with the face without digging in and the club face comes into contact early without bouncing up to the ball and hitting it. The only downside is the temptation to scoop it because if not carefull it will slide right under the ball. My next move is to put into use the tips you have all given me and to work out the pros and cons of "the solution." Incidentally has anyone seen a wedge like this?
Regards, Peter.

[BrianW]

Re: Bounce on hard ground

Hi guys, Thanks for the tips. I'll put them to good use. There is perhaps another solution to clearing the bunker. I have a 60 degree wedge called the "solution" made by dunlop,it has a sharpish edge and a large sole,forming a kind of mouth at the back. I hope that is clear enough. Technically except for the edge it could be said to have a huge bounce. I have been practicing with it at home on hard ground and because of the edge it seems easy to make clean contact with the face without digging in and the club face comes into contact early without bouncing up to the ball and hitting it. The only downside is the temptation to scoop it because if not carefull it will slide right under the ball. My next move is to put into use the tips you have all given me and to work out the pros and cons of "the solution." Incidentally has anyone seen a wedge like this?
Regards, Peter.

I have a negative bounce wedge called a 'Black Widow' (see the picture below) The wedge is around 60 deg loft but by opening the face can be made around 80 deg. Because it has no bounce you can slide the leading edge easily under the ball and get it up high and play some spectacular lob shots. I dont use it these days as I dont want to sacrifice one of my MP R Mizunos for it.

[rotator]

Re: Bounce on hard ground

Hi Peter,

"Incidentally has anyone seen a wedge like this?
Regards, Peter."

There are many wedges like this.

I believe it was the Alien wedge that came out 20 or more years ago with the scooped out cavity in the back and the pronounced bounce. Then there were other that were similar, some without the mouth, but all with the pronounced bottom flange. These would help a golfer, who could then use the club in its normal clubhead position to get the bounce effect, and who can't get used to opening up the face to make effective use of the bounce with a standard wedge.

http://www.aliengolf.co.uk/gallery.asp

It's all good, as long as they work for the golfer, and the clubs conform to the regulations, which these do.

I recall there were a few pros, I remember one LPGA golfer, who had one in the bag.

Ted

[GolfJunkieSr]

Re: Bounce on hard ground

I used that same wedge (56*) you are speaking of for many years. It is still in service in my grandson's bag. It a great club to have in your bag once you know how to use it in different situations. I have probably put 20-25 new grips on that club since we started using it. It can be used off hard pan/thin lies, but remember to keep your hands ahead of the club face at impact, to reduce the bounce this club has. GJS

Hi guys, Thanks for the tips. I'll put them to good use. There is perhaps another solution to clearing the bunker. I have a 60 degree wedge called the "solution" made by dunlop,it has a sharpish edge and a large sole,forming a kind of mouth at the back. I hope that is clear enough. Technically except for the edge it could be said to have a huge bounce. I have been practicing with it at home on hard ground and because of the edge it seems easy to make clean contact with the face without digging in and the club face comes into contact early without bouncing up to the ball and hitting it. The only downside is the temptation to scoop it because if not carefull it will slide right under the ball. My next move is to put into use the tips you have all given me and to work out the pros and cons of "the solution." Incidentally has anyone seen a wedge like this?
Regards, Peter.

[golfshooter]

Re: Bounce on hard ground

Hi guys, thanks again for the good info. It is good to here some others have seen a similar club. It is a difficult club to master but once done so seems to have a variety of uses. I'll put in some practice time with it and let you know how it goes.
Regards, Peter.

[daviesec]

Re: Bounce on hard ground

I have a negative bounce wedge called a 'Black Widow' (see the picture below) The wedge is around 60 deg loft but by opening the face can be made around 80 deg. Because it has no bounce you can slide the leading edge easily under the ball and get it up high and play some spectacular lob shots. I dont use it these days as I dont want to sacrifice one of my MP R Mizunos for it.

Brian, thats a pretty interesting club, I didn't know such a thing existed. As you say I bet you can get some great recovery shots going with it.

[BrianW]

Re: Bounce on hard ground

Brian, thats a pretty interesting club, I didn't know such a thing existed. As you say I bet you can get some great recovery shots going with it.

I can remember being in a pot bunker once that was sat at the base of a green which was a good twelve feet straight above. Using the Black Widow I lobbed it up almost vertical and landed it on the green a foot from the pin to an applause from my playing partners

[AussieGolfBoy]

Re: Bounce on hard ground

in regards to your origional post, you said you had problems hitting the ball, fat, thin and didn't know how to play teh shot.

what i think you may be doing and the cause for the above is slowing down on your followthrough with too large a backswing.

1st things 1st... if the flag is on the close side of you after the bunker, then your probably not going to get it to stop regardless. expect the ball to end up middle of the green at best.

if it's a short shot 30ft or so, then i'd probably go with a 60degree. the stroke you want to play is almost like a firm putt. you don't want a huge backswing. your backswing determines the length the ball will go just like a putt. you want to be speeding up through the ball, not slowing down... this will also help with adding spin to the ball.

so with the LW. you'll probably take a backswing going back about 30% of a full swing, then pushing through the ball to chip it forward and with generous length to land on the green. this should stop your fat and thin shots.