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Unplayable or Obstructed?

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  • #1

    Unplayable or Obstructed?

    I've looked at a few other threads for similarities, but can't go throught them all obviously ;-)

    Immovable Obstruction Scenario

    Played tee shot, went a bit left (they usually go right) and ended up fairway side at the base of a coppiced bush/tree. As a right handed player I cannot take a stance on/in the bush, and because of the overhangs, neither could I swing and play the ball back onto the fairway even back towards the tee!

    I took a one-shot penalty for Unplayable Lie, and played on.

    However, could I have claimed a free relief as the bush in question is not a 'natural' shape and therefore an Immovable Obstruction?


    Flagstick Question

    As I understand the rules, if a putted ball strikes the flagstick, whether it is unattended, attended or lifted, it is a penalty. Is this correct? Does this mean than if you are putting, you MUST remove the flagstick, or you are taking an enormous risk!

    Ball Marking

    If I am on the green, but another player is not yet on the green, can I mark my ball or can he ask me to mark it or do we both have to accept the risk of ball contact? I can see the logic if all players are around the green, but I doubt anyone would ask another player, who has played his tee shot onto the green, to go and mark his ball before taking his own tee shot!
    Last edited by jon@cassonline.net; 08-10-2009, 05:39 PM.
    Tags: None
  • #2
    Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

    Absolutely not.

    I had to check the date to be sure it wasn't April 1
    Last edited by aaa; 08-10-2009, 05:33 PM.

    Comment

    • #3
      Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

      Wow, speedy reply! Sorry to have been rephrasing while you did!

      So to clarify, although my stance/swing is buggered, the fact that it is a growing thing, means that all I can claim is Unplayable and take a 1 shot penalty.

      Comment

      • #4
        Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

        Rub of the green, jon. So, you take your lumps, if your ball ends up under the only extending branch in an otherwise branchless tree.

        Regarding putting, you are correct.

        Regarding marking, the other player can ask you to mark, and he may do so if your ball is in his line to the hole, and his ball may hits your ball and stops it from running closer to the hole. If that is not the case, your ball can remain, and if his ball hits your ball, his ball is played from where it ended up, and your ball is placed back to the spot it was at when it got hit. No penalty, as the other player is off the green.

        If your ball was off to the side or behind the hole, it would be an advantage to the other player to have your ball remain, as it will be a backstop to his ball. As before, your ball is moved to original position. No penalty to either player.

        Ted

        Comment

        • #5
          Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

          Thanks Ted.

          Interesting about the marking, because I felt that my ball was well off his line, but I marked it anyway to keep the peace. I didn't know before today that if he hit my ball, I could replace it.

          If I'd have been him, I'd have prefferred to leave his ball in place, and another ball on the other side of the line so that if I chipped badly, it might do a billiard cannon back on line! LOL!

          Comment

          • #6
            Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

            Originally posted by jon@cassonline.net View Post
            Wow, speedy reply! Sorry to have been rephrasing while you did!

            So to clarify, although my stance/swing is buggered, the fact that it is a growing thing, means that all I can claim is Unplayable and take a 1 shot penalty.
            'fraid so. The operative word is 'obstruction', which is anything artifical. A tree is not.

            Comment

            • #7
              Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

              Originally posted by rotator View Post
              Rub of the green
              A "rub of the green" occurs when a ball in motion is accidentally deflected or stopped by any outside agency (see Rule 19-1).

              Comment

              • #8
                Re: Unplayable vs Obstructed, Flagstick and Ball Marking

                Originally posted by jon@cassonline.net View Post
                Ball Marking

                If I am on the green, but another player is not yet on the green, can I mark my ball or can he ask me to mark it or do we both have to accept the risk of ball contact?
                Rules 22-1 and 22-2 tell you all about it. But you should read 18-5 and 19-5 also, as they explain the consquences of one ball hitting another.

                http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Rules...and-Decisions/

                Comment

                • #9
                  Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

                  On your flag stick question. If the pin is left in the hole, and the ball is on the green , if your putted ball hits the pin, you incur a 2 stroke penalty. Now, that being said I have seen some pretty heated arguments over this. One side of the argument is you get penalized, regardless if the ball does, or does not fall into the hole. The other side is that if the ball hits the flag stick, and goes into the hole there is no penalty. To be honest I have never looked this up since I always pull the flag stick out of habit. GJS

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

                    my understanding of the rule if your ball is on the green and you putt with the flag stick in and hit it, you automatically get a 2 stroke penality.

                    if your ball is on the green and someone wants to come on and they ask you to leave the ball there. "you don't have to". if it's going to help their shot then it's not fair for the rest of the field playing. you have every right to mark your ball..... it's your ball, your game, and why should you help the opposition.

                    in regards to the ball stuck under the tree. i think you nailed that.. take a 1 shot penalty as an unplayable lie..... you can even do this from the bunker, but why risk 1 shot penalty there.

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

                      Originally posted by GolfJunkieSr View Post
                      To be honest I have never looked this up since I always pull the flag stick out of habit. GJS
                      Just to be clear.

                      The player's ball must not strike:
                      a. The flagstick when it is attended, removed or held up;
                      b. The person attending or holding up the                       flagstick or anything carried by him; or
                      c.                       The flagstick in the hole, unattended, when the stroke has been made on the putting green.

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

                        I once asked someone to attend the flag-stick for a long putt. He absent mindedly failed to lift the stick as my ball rolled up and struck it. I was penalised by loss of the hole in matchplay

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

                          Originally posted by aaa View Post
                          A "rub of the green" occurs when a ball in motion is accidentally deflected or stopped by any outside agency (see Rule 19-1).
                          The term is used in as an idiom for "that's the way the ball bounces" or luck, even outside of golf.

                          http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/r...the-green.html

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

                            Originally posted by rotator View Post
                            The term is used in as an idiom for "that's the way the ball bounces" or luck, even outside of golf.

                            http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/r...the-green.html

                            Indeed. But this is about 'Golf Rules'. It is as well to use the terms as used in the Definitions. Then we all know what is going on.

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              Re: Unplayable or Obstructed?

                              Originally posted by BrianW View Post
                              I once asked someone to attend the flag-stick for a long putt. He absent mindedly failed to lift the stick as my ball rolled up and struck it. I was penalised by loss of the hole in matchplay
                              surely there must be small print somewhere that protects you from this. i guess apart from removing the flag yourself and moving it aside, you did everything required by you to get the flag removed. your situation is leaving a big loophole for people wanting to penalise other players on purpose.

                              Comment

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