Correct downswing sequence

[shootin4par]

Re: Correct downswing sequence

since you seem to focus on the swinging style of woods, and it looks like you have, I recommend looking into players like snead and austin and see why they hit it as far and austin farther, with much less effort. Woods comes out of his shoes on that driver, maybe that will help to open a door on why you have distance issues. Learn how to hit balls left and right handed, cause you have to swing the club, and then combine the two.

still working on completely understanding the body, here is someting to help figure out what the hands/wrists can do. take a club and grip left hand only, cock the left wrist and what has happened? you have contracted muscles, then relax the muscles and the club goes back down to the ground, the relaxation of a contracted phase can add speed, the contracted muscle wants to turn back to its normal state. Another example, flex your right arm and the bicep is flexed, now flex your tricep really hard and fast, and the arm will straighten with a lot of force because while the bicep is relaxing, the arm wants to straighten, and while the tricep is contracting the arm wants to straighten, so by the relaxing of the bicep, and contracting of the tricep you get to combine the two and that would equate to more speed then if you just went contraction to relaxation

Tony
in my limited knowledge I would say that regardless of if the hands are active or passive the ice cube tests would show the same results. by cooling down the hands and the muscles in them you loose elasticity, which will limit freedom of motion, so even with passive wrists and hands you have added restriction.

fun discussion guys

[Jeff Mann]

Re: Correct downswing sequence

Neil

I agree with you that relaxation of a contracting muscle can add speed. A good example is what happens when the right forearm/right wrist release occurs in the downswing. Some golfers, like Sergio Gracia, can maintain an incredible amount of right wrist lag until the last possible moment and then relax the right wrist in such an efficacious manner that the clubshaft rapidly accelerates into the ball. I wish I knew how to accomplish that feat.

If you know of a good analysis of Mike Austin's swing, I would like to read it. I visited the MA forum once, but I hated trying to learn about his swing through forum discussions, which were very confusing/contradictory/argumentative. I would prefer reading a book or scholarly review.

Jeff.

[tony_teetime]

Re: Correct downswing sequence

In the downswing, those wrist movements are reversed. However, I believe that it occurs passively in response to centrifugal forces set into play at the central hinge joint (via a double pendulum swing action model). I am personally not aware of any active wrist-hand movements occurring in the downswing phase of the golf swing. If I am in error, please correct me.

Jeff.

Jeff, now we are on the same page. On the downswing, the hands should just react to the centrifugal force while still holding one's cocked and lag as late as he can and let it release naturally. Any added hand action (flippy hands) at this late stage of the downswing would cause undesireable affect.

[tony_teetime]

Re: Correct downswing sequence

Tony
in my limited knowledge I would say that regardless of if the hands are active or passive the ice cube tests would show the same results. by cooling down the hands and the muscles in them you loose elasticity, which will limit freedom of motion, so even with passive wrists and hands you have added restriction.

fun discussion guys

That's correct. Also ,the ice would numb the sensation in your hands and you won't be able to feel and sense the cocking and hinging of the wrist in the backswing. On the downswing it would make it hard to feel when you should release. Many bad shots will come from having ice cold hands.

On another topic, there are "late setters" that do not set their hands during the backswing , but set it as it reaches the apex or top of the swing, some do it as late as the beginning of the downswing. Off the top of my head, I think Jack Nicholas was a late setter of the hands. I think he does it near the top of his swing (it's been awhile since I view his swing so someone may need to confirm that) . Anyhow, I'm gonna have to go give this late set method a field test because I always set the club early. I 'll report back regarding how this method goes or workout.

Good discussion guys... Keep on talking

Oh and just to stay on topic (sequence of downsing) ,I believe it starts from the bottom... beginning with the "slight" bump of the hip toward the target to support the weigh shift and the centrifugal force of the downswing. Another good benefit of this slight hip bump action is it will help to trigger the arms to drop downward. If you do this properly, it would be difficult to cast the hands /arms (otherwise known as the dreaded over the top move) which is what we all strive to avoid in the downswing.

The hip bump is a critical sequence and I believe it should be the beginning of the downswing.

[shootin4par]

Re: Correct downswing sequence

Neil
If you know of a good analysis of Mike Austin's swing, I would like to read it. I visited the MA forum once, but I hated trying to learn about his swing through forum discussions, which were very confusing/contradictory/argumentative. I would prefer reading a book or scholarly review.

Jeff.

jeff, purchase the GIMI video on www.mikeaustingolf.com and get it from the man himself. Then join the forum and discuss. yes, I know it is 50 but it is money well spent, where as some of the other moethods is not really money well spent, imo.
have fun
neil

[BrianW]

Re: Correct downswing sequence

That's correct. Also ,the ice would numb the sensation in your hands and you won't be able to feel and sense the cocking and hinging of the wrist in the backswing. On the downswing it would make it hard to feel when you should release. Many bad shots will come from having ice cold hands.

On another topic, there are "late setters" that do not set their hands during the backswing , but set it as it reaches the apex or top of the swing, some do it as late as the beginning of the downswing. Off the top of my head, I think Jack Nicholas was a late setter of the hands. I think he does it near the top of his swing (it's been awhile since I view his swing so someone may need to confirm that) . Anyhow, I'm gonna have to go give this late set method a field test because I always set the club early. I 'll report back regarding how this method goes or workout.

Good discussion guys... Keep on talking

Oh and just to stay on topic (sequence of downsing) ,I believe it starts from the bottom... beginning with the "slight" bump of the hip toward the target to support the weigh shift and the centrifugal force of the downswing. Another good benefit of this slight hip bump action is it will help to trigger the arms to drop downward. If you do this properly, it would be difficult to cast the hands /arms (otherwise known as the dreaded over the top move) which is what we all strive to avoid in the downswing.

The hip bump is a critical sequence and I believe it should be the beginning of the downswing.

Tony,

I try not to see it as a hip bump, this type of movement can cause the lower body to be thrown out left while allowing the upper body to drop right into a reverse pivot.

I prefer to see it as a gradual transfer of weight to the left foot while the knees start to turn left, the left hip starts to rotate back so that the secondary pivot begins to move around the inside of the left thigh.

[tony_teetime]

Re: Correct downswing sequence

I agree Brian, some people could misinterpret the "slight" hip bump and execute a hip slide instead.

Slight hip bump = good
Sliding hip = bad