Tour tempo

[jesperparnevik]

Re: Tour tempo

Thanx, I appreciate that. May I ask, does the book address how the pro's and great players like Ben Hogan develop/ed this tempo? Is there someway to do it without the tape. Glad to hear you are still having success with it BTW..

Not that I recall, TBH you don't really need the book at all, my original post pretty much sums up wahat the book has to say only he drags it out a little. If you can get yourself a copy of the CD then that's reall yall you need. Tha only important thing to remeber which I never mentioned before is that the 'bleeps' are NOT to be anticipated. Apparently .05 of a second has been incorporated into the timing of the tempo beats for you to 'react' to them. The 3rd bleep is the only one to occur at the same time as an action. ie. after you hear the 1st bleep, then you start your takeaway. after you hear the 2nd bleep, then you start your downswing. the 3rd bleep should be AT impact. That's actually pretty important, should've mentioned that in the original post, not that it makes any difference to the overall theory, it just matters when you are actually using the tempo bleeps for practise.Apparently Ben Hogan used to swing his driver in 21/7 time!!!!

[BIGGUY52]

Re: Tour tempo

sounds interesting......a question though.......would'nt it be one two three(top of the swing) four (impact)?

[jesperparnevik]

Re: Tour tempo

sounds interesting......a question though.......would'nt it be one two three(top of the swing) four (impact)?

Nope, it's 1- takeaway, 2- top of the swing / start downswing, 3- impact.

[mickeyuk]

Re: Tour tempo

if you swung the clubs in your bag with the same tempo .you would have a set distance for each club[providing it wasnt windy and you hit them perfect]you have 60 yards to the green you hit a perfect 24/8,your playing partner is amazed.but not at your tempo but the fact that the ball is 10 yards over the back .its a fat lot of good hitting a 3 iron 190 yards when 175 would have done .golf isnt about how far you hit the ball its about feel.I know where your coming from jesper and your on the right track.But if golf was as easy as playing a cd we would all be on the tour

[Teevino]

Re: Tour tempo

Not at 59, no matter how well I hit the ball . I don't know that jesper is saying that every shot would be a perfect shot, after all the pro's over drive the green quite often, among other things. And then there are also so many other dynamics that go into being a pro other than just hitting good (what does good mean really) shots every time, which they don't. Further some of my best shots now, in terms of pure contact and distance end up in water or the other side of the fairway. I think he is simply saying from his "experience" this method has worked well for him up to now and it just might for others.. Sorry if I am mis-interpreting you jesper. I can assure you, if I had the tape in hand I'd be on the range right now checking it out..

[james.welsh]

Re: Tour tempo

I bought the book last year and had some success. I don't think the point of Tour Tempo is a swing MUST be EXACTLY 3:1 ratio. The point is when it's close to that there's a better "flow" to the entire swing. I find the golf swing is extremely dependent on timing. If the timing/tempo is off you just don't connect all the pieces together in the proper order.

Swing Set Through. Swing Set Through. Swing Set Through. It keeps things simple and when you practice it's nice to have less going on in your head.

Vijay uses Seventeen to keep his swing tempo consistent -- or at least he used to.

When I moved last year I misplaced the book and disk so that was that.

[SKlepJr]

Re: Tour tempo

sounds interesting......a question though.......would'nt it be one two three(top of the swing) four (impact)?

Counting beats in 4/4 that's pretty much it. You take away on beat 1, beat 2 is while the club is going back, beat 3 is when you set/begin the downswing, and impact correlates with the 4th beat.

[james.welsh]

Re: Tour tempo

4th beat might be closer to the end of the follow through...

The audio recording has 2 versions for each speed. I liked the version that said "Swing, Set, Through" to the beat over and over.

Swing... start the backswing (beginning of beat 1)
Set... reach the top of the backswing (Beat 2)
Through... downswing through the ball (Beat 3)
(Beat 4)

[SKlepJr]

Re: Tour tempo

if you swung the clubs in your bag with the same tempo .you would have a set distance for each club[providing it wasnt windy and you hit them perfect]you have 60 yards to the green you hit a perfect 24/8,your playing partner is amazed.but not at your tempo but the fact that the ball is 10 yards over the back .its a fat lot of good hitting a 3 iron 190 yards when 175 would have done .golf isnt about how far you hit the ball its about feel.I know where your coming from jesper and your on the right track.But if golf was as easy as playing a cd we would all be on the tour

I don't think the book is trying to say that every single swing on tour is at an exact 24/8, or 27/9, or whatever. The guy just did some research and found that on normal full swing shots, most touring pros end up swinging in the said 3:1 tempo. He also said that looking at the differences between a "good" shot and a "bad" shot with various players, that there tended to be quite a difference in the tempo between them, suggesting that there was an extra movement somewhere in the swing that made the swing last longer and the shot go offline (makes sense to me). Touching on your argument against say an aggressive 7i vs an easy 6i, I think that the ratio would still remain the same, with the 'tempo' just shifting from say 24/8 to 27/9 to adjust for the difference in swing speed. The book title is a little misleading, because the 0.8 to 1.2 seconds it takes most pros from takeaway to impact is the 'tempo', but the 3:1 ratio actually relates to the rhythm of the swing independant of the specific time it takes. I think the best thing that can be taken from this book is the thought that once you get your mechanics in order and develop a solid tempo through the different positions, you need to practice with that tempo and try to maintain it as closely as possible in order to stay consistent with your shots. But like every other theory, some people will agree with it and some people will not. I for one think that he is on to something.

[SKlepJr]

Re: Tour tempo

4th beat might be closer to the end of the follow through...

The audio recording has 2 versions for each speed. I liked the version that said "Swing, Set, Through" to the beat over and over.

Swing... start the backswing (beginning of beat 1)
Set... reach the top of the backswing (Beat 2)
Through... downswing through the ball (Beat 3)
(Beat 4)

Describing it like that to someone who hasn't heard the CDs is confusing because it makes it seem like the time between swing/set and set/through is the same. The ratio is 3:1 (swing/set:set/through), and short of laying out a rhythm chart in the correct time signature I think saying takeaway on 1, still taking back during 2, top of backswing on 3, and impact @ 4 is reasonably accurate to the way it sounds/feels, especially with the added time on swing and set to account for reaction time.

[SKlepJr]

Re: Tour tempo

Actually my description is dumb, it's just a simple waltz beat (123,123,123,etc), where takeaway is on 1, still in backswing during 2, top at 3, and impact at the next 1.

1(Swing)23(Set)1(Through)

I aplogize for the rambling, I'm tired.

[james.welsh]

Re: Tour tempo

Maybe I'm completely forgetting what I listened to last summer.

I'm going to have to rummage through some boxes in the basement. Forgive me if I've led anyone astray.

I remember Swing Set Through repeating over and over. So what you're saying there is an extra beat between Swing and Set?

Clap, rest, clap clap?

[SKlepJr]

Re: Tour tempo

I remember Swing Set Through repeating over and over. So what you're saying there is an extra beat between Swing and Set?

Clap, rest, clap clap?

Correct, just in 3/4 time. The voice track masks it a bit, but if there weren't an extra beat between swing and set then it would have you takeaway in the same time frame as your set to impact.

[Teevino]

Re: Tour tempo

Correct, just in 3/4 time. The voice track masks it a bit, but if there weren't an extra beat between swing and set then it would have you takeaway in the same time frame as your set to impact.

So if I record a song being played in 3/4 time and play it back on an mp3 player or just hum the tune in my head and swing my club in time with that tempo, that could translate to a 3:1 ratio??

For example "The Tennessee Waltz" would look/feel/sound something like this : 1(beat 1),23(beat 2),4(beat 3).

Doing this in tempo: 1,23,4 1,23,4 1,23,4 1,23,4 or

I wasdan cin with mydar lin to theten ne

Would this/could this translate to a 3:1 ratio in a golf swing?? Are we having fun yet??

I just thought of something (oh no, not again). I have an old friend who I had not seen in some 25 years (since college) and since I started playing the game and knew that he has played since before college I looked him up and played a game with him a couple of weekends ago. Now he is a scratch golfer. He has had the opportunity to play at St. Andrews, Pebble Beach and Augusta National (not the tournaments ya'll just the courses.) Said he shot 83 at Augusta. Not bad for a guy who works full time and played only the one round there. I didn't ask him about the others. His personal best game is a 69. Anyhow, what I remember about his backswing is that it was very slow, almost halting, in its movement. As I think about that swing in my minds eye I would almost bet I could sing the first beat of Tennessee Waltz to that swing. Hah! whadaya think.. Am I crazy?? Well, I already knew that.

[JohnP]

Re: Tour tempo

Paul Mc Cartney's frog song works!