Still teachin Austinology...

[indacup]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

In response to the posting of inacup. I have been an Austinite since 2004. The reason that I became a student of Dan was to find a swing that was friendly to the body. Having 3 herniated disks and another that was bulging I was in a great deal of pain when using the “PGA” sanctioned sing. Dan taught me the Austin swing with newer hand action that produces very straight shots. I have had no back problems with the Austin leverage. It’s a much more linear and less around the spine. Since the spine is only designed to rotate 1 degree all the turning around is very hard on the back. For a right handed golfer; as the right hip posts and the left knee comes in toward the golf ball. You turn under with your left shoulder under your chin. In this position there is no strain on the back and if you sequence the down swing properly (and not over the top) the posting to the left leg and the right elbow will touch the appendix and at this point straighten into the ball with a great deal of power. I’m approaching 60 years old and still hitting 300 yard plus drives is a great thrill. I love the Austin method, a person who takes three lessons are not qualified to comment, on the greatest golf swing ever conceived. Dan Shauger is a fantastic golf pro and very talented. I’ve played many rounds of golf with Dan and at 70 plus years; he can still hit an occasional 300 yard drive. Dan not only hits the ball long despite bone on bone right knee; he has one heck of great short game. The first time I played with him we were on a par three and he said I want you to hit the ball 1 yard to the right of that saddle on the green. He then said here I’ll show you and hit his tee shot straight as a string 1 yard right. I proceeded to hit mine 1 yard left of his mine stayed on the saddle, his rolled down and was 1 foot from the flag. Dan taught me so much about the game of golf. He took me from a 90’s golfer and turned me into a single digit handicapper currently a 6.5 only because the putter left me. My ball striking in fantastic!

Mike, I am glad your experience with Dan was a positive one.

As I stated, I studied the Austin method from both the Pieceriver video and the book "How to Kill the Ball"....I practiced daily and saw good results.

I was encouraged enough that I thought we might incorporate it into our instructional options at our two clubs. Which was why I took the trek out there.

My experience with Dan was unfortunately was not as good as yours, and he admitted he gave me wrong advice....granted I did only take three lessons...and I planned on more. But his advice tore my rotator cuff. So three lessons was all I was able to take due to his "mistake".

Please understand that prior to his bad advice Austinology and Dan were a subject of great debate in another golf forum where we are a sponsor...I defended the system and Dan for months...Dan and i exchanged emails and phone calls and arranged to get me out there, in person to defend him and the system.

I even purchased a SECOND book from Dan and gave it to our head pro, Larry Gladsen who was Zach Johnsons original instructor.

Everything was documented in daily reports to the forum...

From the moment we first met at Dan's practice facility where he showed me the picture on his wall of Ben Hogan and how Hogan was using the Austin system to the beginning instructional I already knew and performed well...to the unfortunate aftermath.

Before I posted the final results, I called Dan up and told him what had happened and all he could muster up was "Well, I didn't explain myself well".

Had he been a man of integrity, he could have offered to give me new lessons once I healed and fix the damage he'd done. Or even gone on line in that forum where he was contributing as well.

But he chose not to anything.

So, while you may say 3 lessons was insufficient time to make a decision, I say that three lessons, months of electronic and verbal communication, hundreds of dollars on lessons, thousands of dollars traveling to see him, medical bills, hundreds of hours in therapy, missing the final half of the season and countless hours of pain was a suitable price to pay to base a decision on.

While you and others may experience wonderful results from Dan, I was physically, financially and emotionally damaged by him...and he really didn't seem to give a damn.

In my book, a persons value and integrity is not measured when things are going well, it's when a person makes a mistake is his integrity and the principles that define him are made evident.

Dan proved himself to believe in a value system I do not condone and cannot support.

[GolfJunkieSr]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

I have watched the swing video of the young lady you speak off. I have even sent the link to one of my grand daughters to show her what hard work can accomplish. The young lady in the video I would bet has a very accomplished physical work out regimen that, in addition to her swing mechanics, allows her to hit the ball those great distances. The young lady is in terrific golf swing shape from head to toe. I dare say most men who want to hit 300 drives will not put in the training she dose to do so.

My mother had a friend who was friend of Errol Flynn the actor. Once while visiting with her friend, she met Mike Austin who was a room mate of Flynn's at the time. This was few years before my time, and a story later on in my life after I took up golf, that my mother shared with me. As in golf, timing is everything......

I have often played (with my younger brother) at the (winterwood) now Desert Rose Golf course Where Austin set the current longest drive in tournament history. In fact I will golfing there next week with him. I know the history books say it was the par 4 fifth hole, but a lot of the locals claim it was the 4th hole, which is now a par 5. My brother says the course has been changed a few times over the years, so the actual hole he hit this monster drive may not be as it was back then. (36 years?) The current 5th hole is a 200 yard par 3, east to west, and the older fifth hole is still a par 4, west to east. It matters little since he was 64, and everyone is in agreement he drove the ball 65 yards past the 450 yard green. My guess is it was the current 14th hole. I know some of the locals who claim they were there at the time have said there was 20-30 mph wind that helped influence that recorded distance.

I find it funny some times how history can get clouded up, and/or forgotten over time. GJS

[Surfmike]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

Inacup, I was an avid surfer most of my life and as a young man I surfed the North Shore of Oahu, for four winter seasons. I surfed many big waves and always surfed up until 2004. Both of my shoulders suffered from torn rotator cuffs and I had to go to physical therapy for 20 weeks. This was in the spring of 2004 after the treatments; the Doctor told me that I needed to work out with the Body Blade everyday for the rest of my life. He said that “your shoulders will never be as strong as they were and that I was easily susceptible to reinjuring the shoulders. "
In October of 2004 I had my first lesson with Dan. The cripple I was with two bad shoulders and three herniated disks and one that was bulging. As I stop and think about the Austin swing I can’t understand how anyone can damage their rotator cuff. As you post to the right leg you turn your shoulder under and the right arm folds. On the down swing you shift to the front foot and simultaneously your right elbow comes to the appendix at this point the club is about waist high and you’re posting up on the left leg. From the waist high position you throw the club through the ball generating a great deal of speed and hitting the ball very far. I’ve never ever hurt my shoulders or my back performing the Austin swing.
I know that many players on the PGA tour who have had to have surgery on their rotator cuffs. Because the PGA swing is very hard on the rotator cuff. The turning and pulling of the PGA swing is hard on the back and hard on the shoulders. I think that in your attempt to try and teach the Austin Swing to yourself, you were probably combining both swings which are a lethal combination. If you are twisting and pull while trying to make the compound pivot you can and will hurt yourself.
I’m sorry that you hurt yourself, but I think it’s wrong to bash and malign a golf swing (Austin swing) that is without a doubt the best swing ever conceived; it is a swing based on kinesiology. Mike Austin had several college degrees and one of them was a PHD in kinesiology, also physics, and mechanical engineering. When you can take 20 handicap golfer who hits his drives 210-230 yards and turn him into a golfer who hits his driver 270-300 yards without a great deal of effort. You have to admit that the mechanics of the swing are far superior to the PGA swing. The Mike Austin method is the most efficient golf swing that has ever been taught. It has the ability to take someone with average athletic ability and turn them into someone who can become a single handicap golfer.
Thanks for hearing me out,
Mike

[indacup]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

Surfmike-

You either did not what I've said completely or misunderstand key information I've shared...maybe I didn't make it clear.

Let me reword it more succinctly:

The Austin swing did not not tear my rotator cuff...as I said I had been doing it sucessfully, for many months prior to seeing Dan.

It was Dans own advice, that he ADMITTED he worded incorrectly that caused the damage.

Dan specifically told me to go out and hit hundreds of practice balls, concentrating on keeping my left elbow behind my right knee at impact

That was the wrong advice he gave.
That was what I did.
That is what tore my Rotator Cuff.
That was what he admitted he should not have said.

My shoulder blew out that weekend, during one of the intense practices he incorrectly prescribed for me.

Once he chose not to make any effort to make amends or even offer an apology after all I invested, I chose to no longer endorse him.

[StevePratt]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

Gentlemen,

Let me introduce myself. I trained under Mike Austin and earned degrees in Kinesiology. I teach his method in Southern California, and use it very successfully to hit super long straight drives.

I have been enjoying reading this thread, there are some very knowledgeable people on here.

If there are any questions out there about the technique or the man, I would be happy to try to answer them if I can.

Steve Pratt
Hititlonger.com

[AustinStudent]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

Sorry to hear of your experience.
I took lessons with Mike for over 5 years and stood by his side watching hours and hours of lessons. If people want to discuss the Austin swing I'll be glad to contribute as well. I have to double check the rules but I have some great video of him commenting (sometimes praising/sometimes blasting) my swing.

Chuck
mentoredbythelegend.com

[Pin High]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

Gentlemen,

Let me introduce myself. I trained under Mike Austin and earned degrees in Kinesiology. I teach his method in Southern California, and use it very successfully to hit super long straight drives.

I have been enjoying reading this thread, there are some very knowledgeable people on here.

If there are any questions out there about the technique or the man, I would be happy to try to answer them if I can.

Steve Pratt
Hititlonger.com

Steve,

Can you post a video as Chuck has of your MA swing also?

[AustinStudent]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

Why would you ever keep your left elbow behind your right knee at impact?
Mike Austin's swing is circular in nature. Mike did teach that due to the proper use of the ankles, knees and hips, you hit it off your side of your body and not the front, but the swing is a free-wheeling motion, not one static point.

[AustinStudent]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

And here's the sad thing about your injury (apart from all the personal pain you suffered) - The fundamental concept behind Mike Austin's swing was the proper use of all the muscles and joints in the body so that they worked efficiently with no pain and no strain.
Here is another video of Mike teaching me.
Note the observation that he makes: ". . . there's no pain, no strain".
Also, note Mike's exuberance as to proper execution of the short game shot.
So many think that Mike taught power golf - not true.
His teachings provided powerful shots, but they were based on the proper motions of the body. His lessons also included much instruction on short game and speciality shots. YouTube - fdates15's Channel (I gave you the channel site so as to not take up bandwidth (?!) on this forum site.)

[Pin High]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

Are you throwing the club from the top of the swing?

[AustinStudent]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

I am. That was a very big deal to Mike. That's where he believed he gained on everyone else. But, it's a Step And A Throw.The pivot starts and it's an underhanded toss up the side of the trailing leg (right leg if you are right handed.) You aren't throwing the club from the top across your body.
Starting with the stance and posture, and then moving into the pivot Mike tried to get the body into a position where the clubhead could be thrown through the hitting area.

It's awfully hard to describe things accurately in text. I was tired of what seeing what I viewed as inaccuracies as to what Mike taught. I created a company and a blog filled with actual video from lessons with Mike. I don't mean to push it here but it does provide imagery Mentored By The Legend
I'd be glad to discuss Mike's approach in this forum. Hope this helps and let me know if you have further questions or comments.

[Pin High]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

How do you throw up the side of the right leg? Are you dropping the arms down the side of the right leg and then up?

[Z06]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

Indacup-

I've also trained under Dan for some time and found him to be incredibly knowledgeable, respectful and kind. I've never had a better instructor. The fact that you took something he said to the point of injuring yourself seems, as others have said, counter to the whole point of the MA swing - which you state you understood well and were successful with before your injury. Keeping the left elbow behind the right knee is described on page 139 of How to Kill the Ball with pictures of Jacob doing exactly that. Sorry to hear that you hurt yourself and sorry to hear that you blame Dan. Apparently some free lessons and an apology would have kept your valuable endorsement.

[lgskywalker37]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

It has been a while since I came to this site. It is great to see there are more austinologist out there.

Austinstudent, thanks for posting up the video lessons. I never met the man, but have studied him extensivley for the past two years and met with one of his students. I really like how you teach what Mike taught, and show what Mike taught instead of teaching your own enturpretations of it. I can tell you know what you are talking about, because you are saying what Mike said.

I can see what Dan was getting at with the left elbow comment but again, that is his swing though or enturpretation of Mike's swing. I would much more prefer if he taught what Mike said and let you get your own swing thoughts. As that is kind of one of my swing thoughts, but I would never tell anyone to do it.

Though I wouldn't call it cryptic by any means, it is highly unlikely that you are going to get it right away and it won't make much sense at first, (especially if you are classically taught) but you just have to trust it because it is correct.

[hoform22xu]

Re: Still teachin Austinology...

Mike did teach that due to the proper use of the ankles, knees and hips, you hit it off your side of your body and not the front, but the swing is a free-wheeling motion, not one static point